If you aren’t armed, you’re in for some of this action. Until we close our borders and throw the illegal scum out of our country, our citizens will be subject to random attacks. Fight back – if your home is invaded, kill them all. 3 illegals beat pregnant woman Trio held for Arizona mayhem rampage Posted: October 21, 2005 1:00 a.m. Eastern
Categories: The Pantheon | 
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I would appreciate advice on travel/mileage credit cards. Capital One seems to be recommended but other comments would be appreciated. I’ve just finished earning the miles on Mileage Plus for a trip I’m going to take , but it has a high annual fee and is limited to United (plus alliance). My destinations will be Australia or Italy, so I need to be able to acquire big miles. I don’t know the ins and outs of the various cards. Thanks…
>I would appreciate advice on travel/mileage credit cards. Capital One > seems to be recommended but other comments would be appreciated. I’ve > just finished earning the miles on Mileage Plus for a trip I’m going to > take , but it has a high annual fee and is limited to United (plus > alliance). My destinations will be Australia or Italy, so I need to be > able to acquire big miles. I don’t know the ins and outs of the > various cards. > Thanks…
It varies from country to country. I’m guessing you’re not Australian or Italian, but there are 167 other countries you might be from and it’s hard to give advice without that piece of information.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I would appreciate advice on travel/mileage credit cards. Capital One > seems to be recommended but other comments would be appreciated. I’ve > just finished earning the miles on Mileage Plus for a trip I’m going to > take , but it has a high annual fee and is limited to United (plus > alliance). My destinations will be Australia or Italy, so I need to be > able to acquire big miles. I don’t know the ins and outs of the > various cards. > Thanks… > It varies from country to country. I’m guessing you’re not Australian or > Italian, but there are 167 other countries you might be from and it’s hard > to give advice without that piece of information.
Sorry. From the US.
Categories: Travel Italy | No Comments »
my photo instructor has visible ink: a nice, tight blackwork spiral on the inside of his left forearm. and in my art appreciation class we had to go around and say our favorite artist or art media, and one guy said his favorite artist is his tattoo artist (couldn’t see any of his work, he was sitting way up behind me and wearing a hoodie, but i caught a glimpse of what looked like sleeves all the way down to his wrists) while one girl said her favorite media is tattoo flash. which, you know, is kind of funny considering tattoos can be so much more than flash, but i have a lot more respect for her than i do for the girls who said they love thomas kinkade and anne geddes.
> which, you know, is kind of funny > considering tattoos can be so much more than flash, but i have a lot > more respect for her than i do for the girls who said they love thomas > kinkade and anne geddes.
Blimey, did people actually say that? I don’t know how a person can choose, but if I did have to choose it would not be the "painter of light" or the mistress of the unbelieveably twee. — vanity domain: www.mssunlight.co.uk To reply replaces prunes with com
> > which, you know, is kind of funny considering tattoos can be so much > more than flash, but i have a lot more respect for her than i do for the > girls who said they love thomas kinkade and anne geddes. > Blimey, did people actually say that?
ayuh. and the girl who picked kinkade? was LOUD AND PROUD about it. i wanted to throw something at her head. i can tell she’s going to be the most annoying person in the class, and not just because she has poor taste in art. she’s a doozy. > I don’t know how a person can choose, but if I did have to choose it would > not be the "painter of light" or the mistress of the unbelieveably twee.
i chose ed ruscha, because i’m madly in love with him. i realize that art is subjective and everyone has different taste and blah blah blah egalitarian-cakes, but kinkade and geddes? that shit is just painful.
TQ> blah blah blah egalitarian-cakes, but kinkade and geddes? that shi TQ> just painful. speaking of shitty, horrid, soi-disant "art", i want to rape georgia o’keefe with a rusty set of hedge clippers. yes, i know she’s dead. that doesn’t change my feelings. lish "what is your position here?" 40.1% / 30 RANA 125 / 68
> speaking of shitty, horrid, soi-disant "art", i want to rape > georgia o’keefe with a rusty set of hedge clippers. > yes, i know she’s dead. that doesn’t change my feelings.
i’m not a big fan either. only one person in the class claimed her, and my boss loves her but my boss is pretty cool so i’m willing to let it slide. i don’t loathe o’keefe, but she bores me and that’s crime enough to put her on my minus list.
> ayuh. and the girl who picked kinkade? was LOUD AND PROUD about it. > i wanted to throw something at her head. i can tell she’s going to > be the most annoying person in the class, and not just because she > has poor taste in art. she’s a doozy.
Kinkade’s work is ghastly chocolate-box stuff, but it’s incredibly detailed and painstaking. Hopefully she’ll be put off by the work involved. There really is too much to choose when it comes to art. I’m lucky in that the National Gallery is only 15-20 minutes from my home and they have several excellent collections as well as regular travelling exhibitions. I’m looking forward to this: http://www.nmgw.ac.uk/feature.shtml?id=24 — vanity domain: www.mssunlight.co.uk To reply replaces prunes with com
re Georgia O’Keefe > my boss loves her but my boss is pretty cool so > i’m willing to let it slide.
There’s a solid basis for criticism. > she bores me and that’s crime enough to put her on > my minus list.
This post and your earlier comments re Thomas Kinkade and Anne Geddes mark you a fool on my minus list. I’m sure Norman Rockwell bores you as well. http://www.onlineartmall.com/limited/thomaskinkade/ http://www.annegeddes.com/indexpages.cfm http://www.okeeffemuseum.org/ http://www.nrm.org/ — Curt http://curtjames.com/
> There really is too much to choose when it comes to art. I’m lucky in that > the National Gallery is only 15-20 minutes from my home and they have > several excellent collections as well as regular travelling exhibitions. > I’m looking forward to this: http://www.nmgw.ac.uk/feature.shtml?id=24
oh, you lucky duck. i have to drive four hours north or south if i want to hit a great museum. i’m not familiar with the johns’ work, but it looks like interesting stuff. i think the next show i hit will be this one: http://moca.org/museum/exhibitiondetail.php?id=350
>>ayuh. and the girl who picked kinkade? was LOUD AND PROUD about it. >i wanted to throw something at her head. > Kinkade’s work is ghastly chocolate-box stuff, but it’s incredibly detailed > and painstaking. Hopefully she’ll be put off by the work involved.
I must chime in about Kinkade. There is a local Thomas Kinkade art gallery here, owned by my friend’s mother (www.thomkinkade.com). I find some of his intricately detailed outdoor scenes very appealing. I’ve spent extended periods of time in the gallery and have never felt miserable by these long periods of exposure to his work. There are certainly far worse artists out there to hate. I’ve read he’s the only living artist who has sold more paintings than Vincent Van Gogh, Monet, Picasso, Gaugin, and Leonardo da Vinci combined. Hunh. I just discovered there are 6 art galleries displaying and selling his work within 50 miles from me. fr0glet
> >>ayuh. and the girl who picked kinkade? >>was LOUD AND PROUD about it. i wanted >>to throw something at her head.
Kinkade inspires passion! One woman is loud and proud about his art while another is ready to throw things at skulls in response. Fantastic! There are examples of an energized and engaged audience. > Kinkade’s work is ghastly chocolate-box > stuff, but it’s incredibly detailed > and painstaking.
Speaking of ghastly chocolate-box stuff, Happy Valentine’s Day to RABbits everywhere. And to call something incredibly detailed and painstaking is obviously not an insult. I believe I misread that the first go ’round. > I must chime in about Kinkade.
Chime in? To tinkle apologetically. Be like that one Kinkade fan: LOUD AND PROUD! > There is a local Thomas Kinkade art > gallery here, owned by my friend’s mother > (www.thomkinkade.com). I find some of his > intricately detailed outdoor scenes very > appealing.
And this is the crux. Appeal. What gets you in your gut, feeds your soul or is candy to your eyes. It’s a question of aesthetics and that’s, in my opinion, the only point worth considering with regard to an artist’s true /value/. It’s not a monetary consideration, but rather what pulls at your heart, eyes, mind. > I’ve read he’s the only living artist who > has sold more paintings than Vincent Van > Gogh, Monet, Picasso, Gaugin, and Leonardo > da Vinci combined.
And units shipped has what import? What significance is there in the fact that an artist has sold a million one-dollar sketches or one million-dollar painting? I don’t believe that quantity sold or dollar amount earned should be the benchmark of success for an artist. An artist can be successful without any customers or even an audience. What happens /within the artist/ during art production is often the mark of success. For what it’s worth, I’ve got my little blue ribbons and have sold my own art, but I don’t believe that’s what makes art something to be valued. There’s a lot to be said for construction paper and glue. Yeah, pass the Elmer’s. 
— Curt http://curtjames.com/
>I’ve read he’s the only living artist who has sold more paintings than >Vincent Van Gogh, Monet, Picasso, Gaugin, and Leonardo da Vinci combined.
What an interesting statement, something I never thought of: I wonder if it’s because those artists didn’t live in a time when art was so accessible and affordable to such a broad section of society. Maybe it’s attributable to the mass production of his work and his motivation to make money, perhaps more so than the artists you mentioned; Kinkade actually markets different sizes and qualities of his lithographs to make himself more marketable to more people. Monet certainly didn’t have the ability to have his works mass manufactured and distributed around the world and he definitely didn’t have an entire company devoted to " aggressive sales and marketing efforts" (as said on the Kinkade website.) This is starting to sound like a discussion of supply and demand curves. ~christyn.
> >I’ve read he’s the only living artist who has sold more paintings than >Vincent Van Gogh, Monet, Picasso, Gaugin, and Leonardo da Vinci combined. Maybe > it’s attributable to the mass production of his work and his > motivation to make money,
Ya think? lets see do one painting have 1000 litho printed and sold VS 1 Sistine chapel This a completely meaningless comparison. How many places have you seen the circled man vs. how many time do you see a Kincade anyplace except on a wall I never have.
Ray writ: > how many time do you see a Kincade anyplace > except on a wall
http://www.mondaymemo.net/040426feature.htm Regardless of your art preferences, Kinkade’s an interesting story. And, yeah, he makes piles of money. — Curt http://curtjames.com/
fg> There are certainly far worse artists out there to hate. don’t you mean far better artists? if you’re speaking of them on the scale of zero to hateable, wouldn’t "better" actually convey "worse"? lish "i have holes poked in me 40.1% / 30 RANA 125 / 68
> fg> There are certainly far worse artists out there to hate. > don’t you mean far better artists? if you’re speaking of them on > the scale of zero to hateable, wouldn’t "better" actually convey "worse"?
No, I think there’s varying levels of hate. I do believe there are worse (worse = less talented, in this case) famous artists, whose work is more hateable. I thought you understood all the intricate details of hatred! Whoare you, and what have you done with Lish? fr0glet
>fg> There are certainly far worse artists out there to hate. > don’t you mean far better artists? if you’re speaking of them on >the scale of zero to hateable, wouldn’t "better" actually convey "worse"?
Hmm, I think a better construction might have "more deserving of hate" in there somewhere. — nj"has plenty of hate to go around"m "Ah! Like a David Mamet movie! Smokin’!" - Mr. Dean succinctly describes my life.
>Ya think? >lets see do one painting have 1000 litho printed and sold >VS >1 Sistine chapel >This a completely meaningless comparison. How many places have you seen the >circled man vs. how many time do you see a Kincade anyplace except on a wall
Well, I never said ‘exposure’ = quality. Think of all the really shoddy tattoo work you’ve seen grace the covers of tattoo magazines and the people who think their tattoo work is the best thing ever simply because it’s the only quality work they’ve ever been exposed to and they don’t know what is really possible. If Kinkade were limited to the production methods and circulation available in the early 1500s, his name wouldn’t even be a blip on the art history map. Even as it stands, I doubt in 2510 people will still be buying Kincade calendars, coffee mugs and prints or discussing him in Art History classes. I’m guessing they’ll have as much meaning as a Home Interiors print has today. ~christyn.
> I doubt in 2510 people will still be buying > Kincade [sic] calendars, coffee mugs and > prints or discussing him in Art History classes.
Still, Kinkade’s got a better shot than you. — Curt http://curtjames.com/
> don’t you mean far better artists? if you’re speaking of them on > the scale of zero to hateable, wouldn’t "better" actually convey "wor
fg> No, I think there’s varying levels of hate. I do believe there are fg> worse (worse = less talented, in this case) famous artists, whose wor fg> is more hateable. fg> I thought you understood all the intricate details of hatred! Whoare fg> you, and what have you done with Lish? i do understand. it’s just my hatred doesn’t usually have many levels. 
BINARY HATRED you are currently bit 0. lish "you bleed your ethics 40.1% / 30 RANA 125 / 68
> BINARY HATRED > you are currently bit 0.
<3 I’m all touched n’ shit! fr0glet
> soul or is candy to your eyes. It’s a question of aesthetics and > that’s, in my opinion, the only point worth considering with regard to > an artist’s true /value/. It’s not a monetary consideration, but rather > what pulls at your heart, eyes, mind.
And that, my dear curt, is why you will never, ever be anything more than a second rate, second grade art teacher. .
> > with regard to an artist’s true /value/. > It’s not a monetary consideration, but > what pulls at your heart, eyes, mind. > And that, my dear curt, is why you will > never, ever be anything more than a > second rate,
I’m not a first rate teacher, but I am working hard. All teachers can improve and I’ve got my eye on that goal. Still, even as a second rater, I’m doing well by my students. > second grade art teacher.
Yeah, second grade as well third, fourth, five, seventh and, possibly next year, eighth. Wait, you meant… http://www.havbruk.no/stockfish/grad2b.html — Curt http://curtjames.com/
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > with regard to an artist’s true /value/. > > It’s not a monetary consideration, but > > what pulls at your heart, eyes, mind. > And that, my dear curt, is why you will > never, ever be anything more than a > second rate, > I’m not a first rate teacher, but I am working hard. All teachers can > improve and I’ve got my eye on that goal. Still, even as a second > rater, I’m doing well by my students.
I’m not sure how anyone can manage to be so pathetic as to be a SECOND rate third grade construction paper cutting teacher. But evidently youve managed to do it. .
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> > with regard to an artist’s true /value/. >> > It’s not a monetary consideration, but >> > what pulls at your heart, eyes, mind. >> And that, my dear curt, is why you will >> never, ever be anything more than a >> second rate, > I’m not a first rate teacher, but I am > working hard. All teachers can improve and > I’ve got my eye on that goal. Still, even > as a second rater, I’m doing well by my > students. > I’m not sure
I’m certain that’s true. > how anyone can manage to be so pathetic as > to be a SECOND rate third grade construction > paper cutting teacher. But evidently youve managed > to do it.
Rubber, glue, somethingsomething. Enjoying yourself? — Curt http://curtjames.com/
Categories: Sistine Chapel | No Comments »
mangled uncounted electrons thus: <snip> >More passengers. If some low cost carrier were to somehow connect the domestic >Southwest and domestic Easyjet networks (however loosely the connection would >be), it would be great marketing and may openb new markets for transatlantic >traffic, just as Ryanair opened new markets by carrying football fans to games. >You know, it could be as simple as Southwest just linking to Easyjet’s web >site to show all the locations they can fly to from Stanstead, and vice versa. >You’d have 2 separate tickets. But by "hubbing" at a common airport to make >transfers palatable, the low cost carriers could feed each other.
That actually makes a lot of sense… And it would be nice to have a transatlantic option out of Stansted… ^_- Martin D. Pay Yes, I live much close to Stansted than to the other airports that serve London … ^_^
> serve the individual routes they can make money on. I see Westjet as > being like Virgin Blue in Australia. DJ has put itself in the position > of Ansett(rip) as a direct competitor to QF, I guess Westjet does the > same with AC.
Correct. And one has to consider that bus and trains are not cheap in canada, so Westjet doesn’t need to offer $25 fares. > much getting people out of trains, cars, and people who wouldn’t > otherwise have travelled at all.
Doesn’t Ryanair cater to football hooligans who can now travel to see games instead of watching them on the tele ? (and for the price of a case of beer). > By definition, any agreement that Ryanair makes with another carrier > will in some way restrict Ryanair’s operations.
Why should it ? > Again the business model of airlines like EZY and FR has check-in > starting 2 hours before departure. If they allow passengers to > check-in 12 hours in advance, then those passengers get delayed, > diveted, held up in immigration, arrested by customs, that will create > an issue at the boarding gate.
Simple: flight leaves without them, period. If you’re not there on time they don’t wait for you. As long as passengers are aware of this when they buy a $50 transtlantic ticket, then there is no issue. > Not to mention when Southwest forgets > to apply FR’s baggage allowances.
Ok, this is an issue. > What is the benefit to them?
More passengers. If some low cost carrier were to somehow connect the domestic Southwest and domestic Easyjet networks (however loosely the connection would be), it would be great marketing and may openb new markets for transatlantic traffic, just as Ryanair opened new markets by carrying football fans to games. You know, it could be as simple as Southwest just linking to Easyjet’s web site to show all the locations they can fly to from Stanstead, and vice versa. You’d have 2 separate tickets. But by "hubbing" at a common airport to make transfers palatable, the low cost carriers could feed each other. Rioght now, if you fly Air Canada to London, connecting to Easyjet at Stanstead or Gatwick isn’t so great. > Ryanair will > want the same income from that seat as they would generate getting a > credit card number direct from a customer, so who is going to pay the > difference?
Is Southwest is going to sell a Dallas-Bari (italy) ticket, then the transatlantic portion could be priced to include all the overhead needed to pay easyjet their full fare to carry the pax from London to Bari. Or you simply don’t sell ticket to Bari, you sell tickets to London and let the pax buy a separate ticket to Bari.
"interlining" means that the airlienes move bags between themselves and you can do one check in. It doesn’t have to mean a through fare from origin to destination. I wonder how much it costs in a negotiated contract? $5.00 per pax? And it goes both ways. I agree that the low cost carriers would win by interlining bags.
>> Apparently Southwest even give you a free drink, and don’t they have > some sort of FF program as well, and allow on-line connections? >Yes. They are low cost but not bare bones low cost. I don’t think that they >offer ridiculously low fares as do Ryannair. > Then Westjet is not a true ‘Next Generation’ low cost carrier. >Not a bare bones one. But consider Westjet, when it expand beyond its original >small playing field in the Alberta/BC, started to have much longer duration >flights. Montreal Vancouver is 5 hours. Does Ryannair have 5 hour flights ?
I don’t think Ryanair (one n!) have 5 hour flights, I seem to remember reading that 1-3 hour sectors fit their business model better. Because they are a purely point to point carrier they are not interested in serving the whole market, having blanket coverage, they only choose to serve the individual routes they can make money on. I see Westjet as being like Virgin Blue in Australia. DJ has put itself in the position of Ansett(rip) as a direct competitor to QF, I guess Westjet does the same with AC. The European lowcosts tend to provide their own products, yes, attracting customers from other airlines, but just as much getting people out of trains, cars, and people who wouldn’t otherwise have travelled at all. > Entering in to an interline agreement with another carrier immediately > brings restrictions to your operations that wouldn’t otherwise be > there. >You are thinking about conventional interlining. Some sort of interlining >agreement between low cost carriers would not necessarily bring in restrictions.
By definition, any agreement that Ryanair makes with another carrier will in some way restrict Ryanair’s operations. >Luggage transfers are Stanstead is not needed due to the need to go through >customers anyways. >So interlining might just mean Southwest acting as a sales agent to Easyjet >and possibly issuing Easyjet boading passes. This would actually reduce costs >at Easyjet who wouldn’t have to process those pax at the check-in counters.
Again the business model of airlines like EZY and FR has check-in starting 2 hours before departure. If they allow passengers to check-in 12 hours in advance, then those passengers get delayed, diveted, held up in immigration, arrested by customs, that will create an issue at the boarding gate. Not to mention when Southwest forgets to apply FR’s baggage allowances. That issue at the boarding gate will delay the flight, and the 7 subsequent flights that day. Why would FR want that hassle? What is the benefit to them? As for costs of processing at check-in, at East Midlands last year EZY had the first flight in the world that was checked in with 100% utilization of self-service check-in machines. It was a publicity stunt, but it won’t be long before that is the norm. >And interlining between 2 low cost carriers does not necessarily require any >responsability to pay hotels etc should a connection be missed. It woudl >essentially be justy a way for each carriers to publish fares that combine >multiple tickets, just as they currently do when they sell you connecting flights.
But these carriers don’t publish fares, other than an indication of ‘from’ prices, they make you an offer when you go to their website and type in your dates. You accept the offer, or go back the next day and see what they offer then. If Southwest were to start selling Ryanair tickets, who is going to pay the costs? Costs involved in accounting processes, the costs of dealing in foreign currencies. Ryanair will want the same income from that seat as they would generate getting a credit card number direct from a customer, so who is going to pay the difference? –==++AJC++==–
Southwest had some sort of cooperative agreement with Icelandair [transatlantic] at Baltimore some years ago. One presumes it wasn’t thought to be a success.
> Apparently Southwest even give you a free drink, and don’t they have > some sort of FF program as well, and allow on-line connections?
Yes. They are low cost but not bare bones low cost. I don’t think that they offer ridiculously low fares as do Ryannair. > Then Westjet is not a true ‘Next Generation’ low cost carrier.
Not a bare bones one. But consider Westjet, when it expand beyond its original small playing field in the Alberta/BC, started to have much longer duration flights. Montreal Vancouver is 5 hours. Does Ryannair have 5 hour flights ? > Entering in to an interline agreement with another carrier immediately > brings restrictions to your operations that wouldn’t otherwise be > there.
You are thinking about conventional interlining. Some sort of interlining agreement between low cost carriers would not necessarily bring in restrictions. Luggage transfers are Stanstead is not needed due to the need to go through customers anyways. So interlining might just mean Southwest acting as a sales agent to Easyjet and possibly issuing Easyjet boading passes. This would actually reduce costs at Easyjet who wouldn’t have to process those pax at the check-in counters. And interlining between 2 low cost carriers does not necessarily require any responsability to pay hotels etc should a connection be missed. It woudl essentially be justy a way for each carriers to publish fares that combine multiple tickets, just as they currently do when they sell you connecting flights.
> Apparently Southwest even give you a free
drink, and don’t they have > some sort of FF program as well, and allow
on-line connections? Some think that WN’s FF program is the most generous in the industry. WN used to have a slogan "the company plane" which emphasized their goal of moderate walkup fares and good frequency to attract business fliers. > Yes. They are low cost but not bare bones low
cost. I don’t think that they > offer ridiculously low fares as do Ryannair.
WN is not always the lowest lowest price carrier. But they seem to be eating the legacy carriers’ lunch with their moderate walkup fares and no-Saturday-night-stay rules. Delta has just given in and is adopting WN’s "formula". Will it work for DL or will they just be foregoing the few high-priced tickets which are slowing down the rate at which they are sinking? Re: Ryanair – do they have an extra charge for seatbacks that recline? Or are all their seats fixed-back these days?
Hi! > (Note > however that if a pax arrives at Stanstead from north america, he’ll have to > pickup luggage and clear customs/immigration, so interlining may not really be > possible to begin with.).
Not if continuing to a different country. brgds — Gunter Herrmann Naples, Florida, USA
>Southwest had some sort of cooperative agreement >with Icelandair [transatlantic] at Baltimore some >years ago. One presumes it wasn’t thought to be a >success.
That must have recently been terminated. I know I saw a reference to it on the Southwest web site within the past year, but I don’t see anything there now.
>> Low-cost carriers – interline – Ryanair? > Real low-cost carriers don’t even offer on-line connections, and > wouldn’t dream of interlining. It would be in total contradiction with > Ryanair’s business model to even contemplate such a move. >When your fares are low enough, you don’t need to interline. Just buy two >separate tickets. If the two "cooperating" carriers operate out of the same >terminal, then switching from Southwest to Easyjet or Ryannair wouldn’t be >very different than switching between two Southwest flights at Chicago Midway.
Don’t Southwest make through bookings? Do they not let you to check-in for both flights together? Do they not then take some responsibility for missed connections? There is nothing to stop you booking 2 FR flights, but they do not, and never will make through bookings, or check you in for onward flights, and if the first one is late and you miss the second, they take no responsibility whatsoever. And this policy has led to their great success. –==++AJC++==–
>> to do so, their long-haul networks wiould die otherwise. Equally there > is no way true low-cost carriers like Ryanair are going to get > involved in any through-checking, interlining nonsense. >Actually, I woudln’t be so sure about that.
You haven’t flown with them, haven’t seen their oeprations first hand. Believe me, they won’t. >Consider Southwest that will CODE SHARE with ATA. Just because the way legacy >carriers implemented interlining ended yp costing a lot of money doesn’t mean >that low cost carriers might not find a cheap way to implement it amongst themselves.
But Southwest is old school. They pioneered the idea, but things have moved on with the low-cost carriers you find in Europe and Asia. Apparently Southwest even give you a free drink, and don’t they have some sort of FF program as well, and allow on-line connections? That would not work as a low-cost carrier in the European market. ‘Next Generation’ low cost carriers cut out everything apart from transport from A to B in accordance with prevailing safety requirements. The tables have really turned, and these days there is more competition is Europe, and greater freedom to compete in Europe than in the US, which is why you find so much more variety in the products on offer. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Look at what happened when Canadian airlines went belly up in Canada. Air >Canada raised its Y fares to ridiculous levels and then has other fares such >as Y2 with the previous Y fares. The net result is that because interlining >rules used the pure Y fare to calculate how much Air Canada could charge >British Airways to carry a pax from Toronto to Winnipeg, It ended up costing >megabucks to british airways to interline with Air Canada and often ended up >being much cheaper for the pax to buy separate tickets. >Clearly, Air Canada was out to sabotage interlining as to not help competitors >in its then monopoly situation. >Consider that Westjet is in negotiations to interline with Cathay Pacific. I >am sure they must be a cost effective way to interline which won’t make all of >Westjet inefficient. >So, Westjet charges a few extra bucks to Catahy to pay for the extra manpower >required to transfer pax/luggage. But that would still be peanuts, and it >wouldn’t negatively impact th rest of westjet operations. >Where there is a will, there is a way.
Then Westjet is not a true ‘Next Generation’ low cost carrier. Entering in to an interline agreement with another carrier immediately brings restrictions to your operations that wouldn’t otherwise be there. Of course it may also bring extra passengers, added revenue, but the likes of Ryanair would not put themselves in that position, they are a phenomenal success because of the way they do business, because they avoid complications such as interlining, or even on-line transfers. >Ryannair is willing to put coin operated overhead lockers, or pay toilets or >make you pay for icecubes in your drink. They surely woudl be willing to >charge a few bucks to interline luggage etc as a convenience for pax. (Note >however that if a pax arrives at Stanstead from north america, he’ll have to >pickup luggage and clear customs/immigration, so interlining may not really be >possible to begin with..
Charging for on board services doesn’t hinder a smooth operation, making some sort of commitment to other airlines and their passengers potentially does. Their whole operation is geared to doing things their way, they are not going to risk that for a few extra passengers that they just don’t need. –==++AJC++==–
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > very potent "club" of low cost carriers making it really cheap for > pax to move > > across the pond. > Very true. I’m surprised the low-fare carriers haven’t attempted > Transatlantic. I’m also surprised they don’t attempt to interline a > little. For example, Canada’s Westjet could interline into Southwest’s > network and flights from North America could interline into Ryanair in > Dublin. >The lowcost carriers don’t interline at all – they won’t even check >you/your bags through on their own airline’s next flight. Each sector is >treated separately, and that’s why they’re lowcost. >There are some semi-lowcost carriers who operate transatlantic. Air >Transat and Zoom spring to mind. Aer Lingus has also become lowcost in >almost all but name (however it’s still trying to keep the market it has, >and *is* checking passengers and bags through to other EI flights). >Hilary
I do think there is still a wolrd of difference between real low-cost carriers, and what the likes of Aer Lingus, Swiss, and to some extent KLM and others are doing to reduce costs by reducing service levels to compete with point to point low cost carriers. As you say they all maintain the other aspects of full service carriers, and will continue to do so, their long-haul networks wiould die otherwise. Equally there is no way true low-cost carriers like Ryanair are going to get involved in any through-checking, interlining nonsense. –==++AJC++==–
> to do so, their long-haul networks wiould die otherwise. Equally there > is no way true low-cost carriers like Ryanair are going to get > involved in any through-checking, interlining nonsense.
Actually, I woudln’t be so sure about that. Consider Southwest that will CODE SHARE with ATA. Just because the way legacy carriers implemented interlining ended yp costing a lot of money doesn’t mean that low cost carriers might not find a cheap way to implement it amongst themselves. Look at what happened when Canadian airlines went belly up in Canada. Air Canada raised its Y fares to ridiculous levels and then has other fares such as Y2 with the previous Y fares. The net result is that because interlining rules used the pure Y fare to calculate how much Air Canada could charge British Airways to carry a pax from Toronto to Winnipeg, It ended up costing megabucks to british airways to interline with Air Canada and often ended up being much cheaper for the pax to buy separate tickets. Clearly, Air Canada was out to sabotage interlining as to not help competitors in its then monopoly situation. Consider that Westjet is in negotiations to interline with Cathay Pacific. I am sure they must be a cost effective way to interline which won’t make all of Westjet inefficient. So, Westjet charges a few extra bucks to Catahy to pay for the extra manpower required to transfer pax/luggage. But that would still be peanuts, and it wouldn’t negatively impact th rest of westjet operations. Where there is a will, there is a way. Ryannair is willing to put coin operated overhead lockers, or pay toilets or make you pay for icecubes in your drink. They surely woudl be willing to charge a few bucks to interline luggage etc as a convenience for pax. (Note however that if a pax arrives at Stanstead from north america, he’ll have to pickup luggage and clear customs/immigration, so interlining may not really be possible to begin with.).
> Low-cost carriers – interline – Ryanair? > Real low-cost carriers don’t even offer on-line connections, and > wouldn’t dream of interlining. It would be in total contradiction with > Ryanair’s business model to even contemplate such a move.
When your fares are low enough, you don’t need to interline. Just buy two separate tickets. If the two "cooperating" carriers operate out of the same terminal, then switching from Southwest to Easyjet or Ryannair wouldn’t be very different than switching between two Southwest flights at Chicago Midway.
> very potent "club" of low cost carriers making it really cheap for > pax to move > across the pond. > Very true. I’m surprised the low-fare carriers haven’t attempted > Transatlantic. I’m also surprised they don’t attempt to interline a > little. For example, Canada’s Westjet could interline into Southwest’s > network and flights from North America could interline into Ryanair in > Dublin. > I’m too lazy to google it up, but could an ETOPS 737 cross the > Atlantic? (I know Air Pacific operates three-sevens from Fiji to > Vancouver via Hawaii.)
Lufthansa have flown Germany – USA for some time on a wet-leased Boeing business jet (737 family) and, latterly, with an Airbus A319. Anyone wanting to set up a commercial relationship with Ryanair would, imo, be certifiable! JohnTu
>> very potent "club" of low cost carriers making it really cheap for >pax to move > across the pond. >Very true. I’m surprised the low-fare carriers haven’t attempted >Transatlantic. I’m also surprised they don’t attempt to interline a >little. For example, Canada’s Westjet could interline into Southwest’s >network and flights from North America could interline into Ryanair in >Dublin.
Low-cost carriers – interline – Ryanair? Real low-cost carriers don’t even offer on-line connections, and wouldn’t dream of interlining. It would be in total contradiction with Ryanair’s business model to even contemplate such a move. –==++AJC++==–
The Hammering You Hear…. is probably Southwest driving the final nails in US Airways’ coffin. Today WN announced that they would be starting service to Pittsburgh in May 2005.
> Today WN announced that they would be starting > service to Pittsburgh in May 2005.
I think that the worse case scenario for US Air will be similar to ATA. US Air will continue to operate while the process of selling its assets proceeds. In the end, US Air may be a small airline, or its remains may simply be too endebted to survive, but the impact on travellers may not be so bad if WN or Jetblue step in. Now, watch out if Southwest or Jetblue get US Air to continue to exist with just its international flights which would be turned into low cost operations that are fed and feed into the domestic low cost networks. People would detour via PHL if it meant they saved $100 or more on a transtlantic fare. In fact, move the flight to Stanstead and hookup with easyjet there and you’re have a very potent "club" of low cost carriers making it really cheap for pax to move across the pond.
> very potent "club" of low cost carriers making it really cheap for pax to move > across the pond.
Very true. I’m surprised the low-fare carriers haven’t attempted Transatlantic. I’m also surprised they don’t attempt to interline a little. For example, Canada’s Westjet could interline into Southwest’s network and flights from North America could interline into Ryanair in Dublin. I’m too lazy to google it up, but could an ETOPS 737 cross the Atlantic? (I know Air Pacific operates three-sevens from Fiji to Vancouver via Hawaii.) Cheers, Geoff Glave Vancouver, Canada
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This article is an update from when the Holiday made its 4 day trip to Cozumel on 12/30 a Cruise To Nowhere. This article is in today’s Mobile Register. David Jacobson Baton Rouge Holiday faces week in dry dock Saturday, January 01, 2005 By EDDIE CURRAN Staff Reporter Vacationers with reservations aboard Carnival’s Holiday won’t be cruising to Mexico but will instead be visiting closer destinations or no destinations at all, a company spokeswoman said Friday. Some voyages scheduled for this month face cancellation, she said. The Holiday’s next cruise, a five-day voyage departing Monday with day-long stops in Cozumel and Playa del Carmen, won’t make it to those Mexican resorts, said spokeswoman Jennifer de la Cruz. Instead, the ship is headed to Key West, Fla., where passengers will have several hours to go ashore, she said. By early next week, the company hopes to know when the Holiday can come out of the water for repairs. The repair schedule will in turn determine the status of future cruises, the spokeswoman said. One thing’s for certain: The Holiday’s engine requires repairs that are expected to take a week or longer, and cruises prior to those repairs won’t be making their scheduled stops in Mexican resort areas, said de la Cruz. The Holiday can only sail at about half speed, and in the allotted time periods can’t make it to Mexico and back, she said. "We haven’t officially made any determinations beyond Monday’s voyage, because we’re trying to nail down when the ship will go into dry docks," said de la Cruz. "We want to have all our ducks in row before we start making any announcements beyond Monday." Carnival, which operates the Holiday, is contacting travel agents who booked people on Monday’s cruise to notify their customers of the change. Passengers will have the option of canceling and receiving a refund or a credit for a future cruise, or proceeding with their trips. Those who choose the second option will receive a $100 credit for on-board purchases. "We did send faxes to all the travel agents, but given that it’s a holiday weekend, we’re hoping that as many people as possible get the word," de la Cruz said. Those who don’t will be told about the change in plans as they arrive at the Mobile Cruise Terminal on Monday, she said. Alton Wallace of Orange Beach and his wife Patsy won’t be making the drive to Mobile on Monday, he said. "I don’t really want to go to Key West. I’d rather just get my money back if that’s what they’re going to do," Wallace said Friday. The Wallaces have one of about 20 cabins reserved by choir members at Gulf Shores Methodist Church, he said. "I’ve heard from several others that they would just want their money back," he said. The engine problems developed on the voyage that returned to port Thursday morning, and the company immediately tried to ascertain the extent of the problems, as passengers for that afternoon’s cruise arrived at the terminal. "They brought in divers to look at the ship, and by the time they realized the extent of the problem, we had processed about 250 people (for Thursday afternoon’s trip) and had another 300 in line waiting," Mobile cruise terminal director Al St. Clair said Friday. Carnival decided to go ahead with the four-day cruise, and to call it the "Cruise to Nowhere." That’s an industry term usually applied to planned two-day trips without a destination, said the Carnival spokeswoman. About 5 percent of the 1,700 people canceled but most went ahead with the trip, a company official said. The reaction to the news was mixed, but there was "not anybody who was real happy," said St. Clair, who was at the terminal Thursday. "It was not an easy decision for people to make, and we had quite a few people who deliberated quite awhile," St. Clair said. "One of the concerns was, ‘How far would they be going?’ They wanted to go some place warmer where they could enjoy the pool, and at that point in time, it was rather sketchy, and I still don’t know how far out they went," he said. "We tried to help them from a terminal standpoint as much as we could, and those that left, we refunded their parking money right away," he said. As of Friday afternoon, de la Cruz wasn’t sure how far south the Holiday would venture. "The captain will just be looking for good weather and smooth seas," she said. "One of the nice things is that they don’t have to sail to a particular direction and they can just try to find good weather." The ship, which is the oldest vessel in Carnival’s fleet, requires a part that’s made in Italy, St. Clair said. The second factor, he said, is available space at a ship repair facility, probably Mobile’s Atlantic Marine. Said de la Cruz, "The facility has to have room for us and we have to have parts in, so there’s quite a bit involved to get it scheduled, but we’re working diligently." Currently scheduled cruises past Monday include the five-day excursion to Mexico set to leave Thursday, a four-day trip set to depart next Saturday, and a five-day voyage scheduled to begin Jan. 16. That trip almost surely will be canceled, St. Clair said. "They’re going to go into dry dock and they expect to be in dry dock for about a week to repair the engine, then they’ll need to do a sea trial," the Mobile city official said. De la Cruz encouraged people with reservations for upcoming voyages to contact their travel agents. Also, they can call 1-800-CARNIVAL. "We’ll give them updates as soon as we have them," she said. The city invested $20 million in the cruise terminal, and bad news for Carnival is bad news for the city. St. Clair said he hopes news of the Holiday’s problems won’t dampen what to date has been a successful operation. "Some people will, I guess, think a little bit more carefully before taking a cruise out of here than they normally would, but other than that, we’re doing the best we can," St. Clair said. "We try to make it as painless as possible from a terminal standpoint."
snip >The engine problems developed on the voyage snip >"They brought in divers to look at the ship,
Divers to inspect mills? Unless it was an intake issue, divers would only be called in for running gear inspection (or hull eyeballing). The engines are inside the ship, although I guess in the case of electric pods, one could consider the pods themselves as an "engine". Tis a bummer about the CTN that those who entered into a passage contract had to make do with. Stuff happens <shrug>
This article is an update from when the Holiday made its 4 day trip to Cozumel on 12/30 a Cruise To Nowhere. This article is in today’s Mobile Register. David Jacobson Baton Rouge Holiday faces week in dry dock Saturday, January 01, 2005 By EDDIE CURRAN Staff Reporter Vacationers with reservations aboard Carnival’s Holiday won’t be cruising to Mexico but will instead be visiting closer destinations or no destinations at all, a company spokeswoman said Friday. Some voyages scheduled for this month face cancellation, she said. The Holiday’s next cruise, a five-day voyage departing Monday with day-long stops in Cozumel and Playa del Carmen, won’t make it to those Mexican resorts, said spokeswoman Jennifer de la Cruz. Instead, the ship is headed to Key West, Fla., where passengers will have several hours to go ashore, she said. By early next week, the company hopes to know when the Holiday can come out of the water for repairs. The repair schedule will in turn determine the status of future cruises, the spokeswoman said. One thing’s for certain: The Holiday’s engine requires repairs that are expected to take a week or longer, and cruises prior to those repairs won’t be making their scheduled stops in Mexican resort areas, said de la Cruz. The Holiday can only sail at about half speed, and in the allotted time periods can’t make it to Mexico and back, she said. "We haven’t officially made any determinations beyond Monday’s voyage, because we’re trying to nail down when the ship will go into dry docks," said de la Cruz. "We want to have all our ducks in row before we start making any announcements beyond Monday." Carnival, which operates the Holiday, is contacting travel agents who booked people on Monday’s cruise to notify their customers of the change. Passengers will have the option of canceling and receiving a refund or a credit for a future cruise, or proceeding with their trips. Those who choose the second option will receive a $100 credit for on-board purchases. "We did send faxes to all the travel agents, but given that it’s a holiday weekend, we’re hoping that as many people as possible get the word," de la Cruz said. Those who don’t will be told about the change in plans as they arrive at the Mobile Cruise Terminal on Monday, she said. Alton Wallace of Orange Beach and his wife Patsy won’t be making the drive to Mobile on Monday, he said. "I don’t really want to go to Key West. I’d rather just get my money back if that’s what they’re going to do," Wallace said Friday. The Wallaces have one of about 20 cabins reserved by choir members at Gulf Shores Methodist Church, he said. "I’ve heard from several others that they would just want their money back," he said. The engine problems developed on the voyage that returned to port Thursday morning, and the company immediately tried to ascertain the extent of the problems, as passengers for that afternoon’s cruise arrived at the terminal. "They brought in divers to look at the ship, and by the time they realized the extent of the problem, we had processed about 250 people (for Thursday afternoon’s trip) and had another 300 in line waiting," Mobile cruise terminal director Al St. Clair said Friday. Carnival decided to go ahead with the four-day cruise, and to call it the "Cruise to Nowhere." That’s an industry term usually applied to planned two-day trips without a destination, said the Carnival spokeswoman. About 5 percent of the 1,700 people canceled but most went ahead with the trip, a company official said. The reaction to the news was mixed, but there was "not anybody who was real happy," said St. Clair, who was at the terminal Thursday. "It was not an easy decision for people to make, and we had quite a few people who deliberated quite awhile," St. Clair said. "One of the concerns was, ‘How far would they be going?’ They wanted to go some place warmer where they could enjoy the pool, and at that point in time, it was rather sketchy, and I still don’t know how far out they went," he said. "We tried to help them from a terminal standpoint as much as we could, and those that left, we refunded their parking money right away," he said. As of Friday afternoon, de la Cruz wasn’t sure how far south the Holiday would venture. "The captain will just be looking for good weather and smooth seas," she said. "One of the nice things is that they don’t have to sail to a particular direction and they can just try to find good weather." The ship, which is the oldest vessel in Carnival’s fleet, requires a part that’s made in Italy, St. Clair said. The second factor, he said, is available space at a ship repair facility, probably Mobile’s Atlantic Marine. Said de la Cruz, "The facility has to have room for us and we have to have parts in, so there’s quite a bit involved to get it scheduled, but we’re working diligently." Currently scheduled cruises past Monday include the five-day excursion to Mexico set to leave Thursday, a four-day trip set to depart next Saturday, and a five-day voyage scheduled to begin Jan. 16. That trip almost surely will be canceled, St. Clair said. "They’re going to go into dry dock and they expect to be in dry dock for about a week to repair the engine, then they’ll need to do a sea trial," the Mobile city official said. De la Cruz encouraged people with reservations for upcoming voyages to contact their travel agents. Also, they can call 1-800-CARNIVAL. "We’ll give them updates as soon as we have them," she said. The city invested $20 million in the cruise terminal, and bad news for Carnival is bad news for the city. St. Clair said he hopes news of the Holiday’s problems won’t dampen what to date has been a successful operation. "Some people will, I guess, think a little bit more carefully before taking a cruise out of here than they normally would, but other than that, we’re doing the best we can," St. Clair said. "We try to make it as painless as possible from a terminal standpoint."
snip >The engine problems developed on the voyage snip >"They brought in divers to look at the ship,
Divers to inspect mills? Unless it was an intake issue, divers would only be called in for running gear inspection (or hull eyeballing). The engines are inside the ship, although I guess in the case of electric pods, one could consider the pods themselves as an "engine". Tis a bummer about the CTN that those who entered into a passage contract had to make do with. Stuff happens <shrug>
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We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent? — squeezie51 squeezie51’s Profile: http://travelforums.org/forums/member.php?userid=419 View this thread: http://travelforums.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61737 This post was submitted via http://www.TravelForums.org
We’ve done a couple Uniworld cruises and loved them both. Christmas Markets in Germany, and the French Wine cruise. It’s not a luxury main stream ocean cruise to be sure, but we would book with them again in a minute. We had no problems what so ever, and the one in France was one of our best vacations ever. .
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. > Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent? > — > squeezie51 > squeezie51’s Profile: http://travelforums.org/forums/member.php?userid=419 > View this thread: http://travelforums.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61737 > This post was submitted via http://www.TravelForums.org
A friend took one & was not happy ! Food choice was very limited, almost every day it was fish or fish or local fish & i don’t like fish! Also there is no pool , no casino , no hot tubs , no shows no safe in cabins ,All provided at a very high price! My wife wanted to go ,till we checked it out ! Don’t forget the dollar isn’t worth zilch in Europe now! BILL
Good Morning: We have no personal experience with Uniworld so cannot speak about their product. We have been on Viking River Cruises, Rhone River in France, and loved every aspect of it. We went in mid October and had great weather. Ship was clean and neat, food was limited in choice but excellent preparation and service. Best part of it was that there was no pool, no casino, no big gaudy floor shows, nothing to detract from the relaxing River Cruise Experience. We would repeat that trip in a minute and hope to do so in the near future. If you do need the distractions however, and are easily amused by bright shiny objects, then you should reconsider. Stay with Caribbean Cruises or trips to Vegas. Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. >Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent?
>We are investigating taking a Uniworld River >Cruise in Russia or Italy. Does anyone have >any experience with them, good, bad, or >indifferent?
We booked a Uniworld cruise in Holland and Belgium for between Christmas 2003 and just after New Years’ 2004. They took our deposit and final payment, and then they sold out the ship to some group leaving us high and dry. We had to hassle them to get our credit card credited. We did eventually take a land trip to Amsterdam in that period, but we would not consider another Uniworld cruise even if they gave it to us for free.
> We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. > Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent?
We "sort of" took a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia last summer. The "sort of" means that we traveled with a group that had booked space on a Uniworld ship, the M.S. Litvinov. There were aspects of our cruise that were provided by Uniworld — food and shipboard accommodations — and aspects of our trip that were provided by our tour company — guides and transportation at each destination. The Litvinov’s cabins are adquately-sized with limited but efficient storage space. The bathroom is quite spartan, with the shower being a plastic curtain marking off an area within the bathroom. The beds are adequate, but beds are a hot item in the ocean-going cruise/hotel industry so the Litvinov’s beds don’t approach the "Perfect Bed" or "Comfort Bed" or whatever trade name each company is touting. The food is surprisingly good and there is a serious attempt made to accommodate special diets. The area where I perceived Uniworld to be weak is in the area of guides. They sent their shipboard personnel — social hostesses, etc. — along with guests to destinations. Something makes me think that these shipboard workers were the only guides. In contrast, our group picked up specialists at each of our destinations. I would check out this aspect of the cruise. Over all, we found our trip to Russia fascinating and had no regrets about the experience. Karen Selwyn
We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent? — squeezie51 squeezie51’s Profile: http://travelforums.org/forums/member.php?userid=419 View this thread: http://travelforums.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61737 This post was submitted via http://www.TravelForums.org
> We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. > Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent?
We "sort of" took a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia last summer. The "sort of" means that we traveled with a group that had booked space on a Uniworld ship, the M.S. Litvinov. There were aspects of our cruise that were provided by Uniworld — food and shipboard accommodations — and aspects of our trip that were provided by our tour company — guides and transportation at each destination. The Litvinov’s cabins are adquately-sized with limited but efficient storage space. The bathroom is quite spartan, with the shower being a plastic curtain marking off an area within the bathroom. The beds are adequate, but beds are a hot item in the ocean-going cruise/hotel industry so the Litvinov’s beds don’t approach the "Perfect Bed" or "Comfort Bed" or whatever trade name each company is touting. The food is surprisingly good and there is a serious attempt made to accommodate special diets. The area where I perceived Uniworld to be weak is in the area of guides. They sent their shipboard personnel — social hostesses, etc. — along with guests to destinations. Something makes me think that these shipboard workers were the only guides. In contrast, our group picked up specialists at each of our destinations. I would check out this aspect of the cruise. Over all, we found our trip to Russia fascinating and had no regrets about the experience. Karen Selwyn
>We are investigating taking a Uniworld River >Cruise in Russia or Italy. Does anyone have >any experience with them, good, bad, or >indifferent?
We booked a Uniworld cruise in Holland and Belgium for between Christmas 2003 and just after New Years’ 2004. They took our deposit and final payment, and then they sold out the ship to some group leaving us high and dry. We had to hassle them to get our credit card credited. We did eventually take a land trip to Amsterdam in that period, but we would not consider another Uniworld cruise even if they gave it to us for free.
We’ve done a couple Uniworld cruises and loved them both. Christmas Markets in Germany, and the French Wine cruise. It’s not a luxury main stream ocean cruise to be sure, but we would book with them again in a minute. We had no problems what so ever, and the one in France was one of our best vacations ever. .
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. > Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent? > — > squeezie51 > squeezie51’s Profile: http://travelforums.org/forums/member.php?userid=419 > View this thread: http://travelforums.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61737 > This post was submitted via http://www.TravelForums.org
A friend took one & was not happy ! Food choice was very limited, almost every day it was fish or fish or local fish & i don’t like fish! Also there is no pool , no casino , no hot tubs , no shows no safe in cabins ,All provided at a very high price! My wife wanted to go ,till we checked it out ! Don’t forget the dollar isn’t worth zilch in Europe now! BILL
Good Morning: We have no personal experience with Uniworld so cannot speak about their product. We have been on Viking River Cruises, Rhone River in France, and loved every aspect of it. We went in mid October and had great weather. Ship was clean and neat, food was limited in choice but excellent preparation and service. Best part of it was that there was no pool, no casino, no big gaudy floor shows, nothing to detract from the relaxing River Cruise Experience. We would repeat that trip in a minute and hope to do so in the near future. If you do need the distractions however, and are easily amused by bright shiny objects, then you should reconsider. Stay with Caribbean Cruises or trips to Vegas. Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->We are investigating taking a Uniworld River Cruise in Russia or Italy. >Does anyone have any experience with them, good, bad, or indifferent?
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ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was our 7th cruise together. ABOUT THE SHIP: If you have a specific idea of what cruising should be like, with a thousand detailed requirements, you will not enjoy this ship. It does not offer the same experience as Carnival, Royal Caribbean or Norwegian and probably never will. If, on the other hand, you find the interplay of cultures fascinating, and find differences stimulating instead of just "wrong," you’ll have a wonderful time. MSC is an Italian company. They are the second largest cargo line in the world and are relatively new to the cruise market so there are some good values to be had. At least half of the passengers on our ocean crossing were Europeans and the blessedly few PA announcements were in five languages: English, German, Italian, French and Spanish. Service personnel must function in most of these languages. Some do this better than others, but all seemed pleasant and patient. The MSC Opera is new and is a sleek greyhound. It was designed for the luxury trade before the decision was made to pursue the budget end of the market. The interiors are quietly elegant in dark blues, smoky plums, corals and creams. There’s no art in particular but the lighting fixtures are well designed like big sculptures. The ship lacks glass-sided elevators, high atriums and Vegas-style metallic glitz, but makes up for it by being really comfortable, human-scaled like a good European hotel. Lots of small places to settle in. Lots of glass and views of the sea. We had an inside cabin. It was not the largest we’ve been in, but the mirror layout was the best we’ve seen, giving more light and sense of space than we expected. The bathroom was equally well-planned, generously sized with an excellent shower. Water heat and pressure were both good. The smaller of the two restaurants, L’approdo, is a jewel box of red and pink. The larger restaurant, La Caravella, is very sophisticated in green, cream and yellow, with lots of columns and divisions so it seems more intimate than its size would indicate. There is a cafeteria on the top deck with indoor and outdoor seating. The top deck also has two pools and is very lively. There is often an excitable host screaming in 4 or 5 languages, running incomprehensible games and contests with enthusiastic passengers, Europop blaring on the speakers. If you want quiet, there are lounge chairs on the Boat Deck most days and also at the stern of many of the cabin decks. ABOUT THE FOOD: Extraordinarily good. Northern Italian. We were on for 17 days and they didn’t miss on a pasta or risotto once. Good pizza, superb homemade ice cream, excellent bread, good soup. We found the meat entrees a little lacking but others singled them out as exceptional. You could always get a grilled sirloin or chicken if you didn’t like the chef’s entrees. The cakes were of the baba au rhum variety. Very airy and not much chocolate, but plenty of variety. Lots of salads and fresh fruit, plus fresh fruit in the rooms. The waiters are Italian and joke a little heavily at first and not always successfully in an attempt to charm you. On the whole they are very good. When I expressed a preference for ice tea and breadsticks rather than rolls, I found them waiting every night. Luigi was an excellent waiter, Mario and Carlo excellent maitre’d’s (and Sylvie was a superb cabin steward too.) MSC has a policy that you don’t have to tip if you don’t want to. This is churlish, the staff deserves it, they work hard. We followed the policy we have always followed. We ignored management’s guidelines and tipped what we wanted to and felt was appropriate. THE BEST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: The intimacy and sheer livability of the ship are the main virtues for us, but one of the most civilized things is that they allow you to get duty free liquor and open it and consume it in your room. They don’t seal it for the voyage so you’ll order more from the bars like many lines do. THE WORST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: There are two really bad things about the ship: 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light up. Some Americans complained to the offenders but many of the smokers didn’t speak English, so it was futile. We never saw staff do anything to enforce the no-smoking areas. I am asthmatic and suffer from smoke, but I was able to get away from it OK. Judge for yourself whether it makes a difference to you. 2) MANAGEMENT: Charming but utterly chaotic. Generally inefficient and sometimes maddeningly so and in odd ways. The loading of the ship in Genoa, for example, was the most efficient I have ever seen. You checked in, reserved your dining table, and booked your shore excursions in one very smooth line. But once on board, both the purser’s and excursion desks were uninformed and uncoordinated. For example, we tried to book a transfer from the dock to Ft. Lauderdale airport. Reception said Shore Excursions handled that, Shore Excursions said Reception handled that, they bounced us back and forth, called each other and yelled into the phone. We eventually did get to the airport and make our flight, but a little more coordination would have worked wonders with the experience. Similarly the 24 hour internet service broke down periodically because the satellite gave them problems. Nobody had any idea when it would be fixed. There is a technician on board but service remained unreliable. Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved 24 hours later. THE PEOPLE ON BOARD: The Americans on board this repositioning cruise were largely retired people, many from Florida. They are very experienced budget cruisers. They have taken every line and they have very set expectations about what they like and want from a cruise. When they don’t get what they are used to from Carnival, Royal Caribbean, etc., they don’t perceive this European ship as different, they perceive it as WRONG! This makes some of them very hostile. For example, there are only small cups of ice water on a hot day. Not spigots of iced tea or fruit juice like on other ships. There is iced tea but only in the dining rooms. Not in the cafeteria or on the outdoor patio. This one thing made a lot of people hostile. (Until management gets around to this one, bring a tall insulated mug and make your own). We were told there is little music for ballroom dancing at night. Only disco (I guess their Mediterranean cruises have more young people -Europeans have longer vacations than us and the American passengers skewed older). There are movies on the TV but they are dubbed in many languages. And the English-language originals are often not on at convenient times, nor are the schedules reliable. "Welcome to Mooseport" loses something when dubbed in German (I’m not kidding). And some passengers just don’t like it when they are so many people on board that they can’t talk to, and they grow impatient when instructions have to be translated. Also, some cultures are trained to get on line, while others just crowd in, which makes for conflict. If management would put rope lines like a bank in front of the reception counter, that might defuse a lot of bad feeling. We read some hostile reviews of this ship and its sister ship, the Lirica before we booked this, but we must say we enjoyed the experience thoroughly and found it a phenomenal value. You just have to know what you are getting in to. SHOPS: Very tasteful and very expensive, which made no sense at all. The shops were one part of the ship not recalibrated for budget cruising. The stock was entirely for the European market, the wrong weight clothing and not even in American sizes. They didn’t sell bottles of aspirin or Tylenol, but did sell several kinds of expensive anti-cellulite cream. Considering the average age and needs of the Caribbean cruisers this is pretty odd. Also, one lone bottle of SPF sunblock shared shelf space with plentiful supplies of old-fashioned tanning butter. If they sold some insulated mugs with the ship’s logo, they’d clean up and stop the no iced tea hostility, but they are not yet that sensible. The $350 dollar sweaters didn’t sell even at 50% off. When the temperature outside went to 90 degrees, people wanted tee shirts. They only had a few, they were expensive and for sale only in the liquor store! A simple $29 item in the jewelry shop would have sold out. But they didn’t have anything at all in that category. SHORE EXCURSIONS: The stops on our crossing were: Barcelona, Casablanca, Funchal, Barbados, Antigua, Tortola, St. Maarten, and Nassau. Generally well run. Remember to bring Euros for Barcelona and Funchal (not all the Americans on board did). The ship charges 3 percent to change money. This includes 3 percent to cash travelers checks which is a bum deal. They’re supposed to be cash. The full day excursion to Marrakesh from Casablanca which includes a 4 hour bus trip both ways is exhausting but sooo worth it! Don’t miss this one. In Madeira, we found riding a wicker … read more »
ervice remained unreliable. > Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a > barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed > the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was > an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved > 24 hours later.
I will be sure to relay that message to Vanessa and her roomate Amanda Not that I am a proud father or anything! > HOPE FOR THE FUTURE: > MSC has hired management from American cruise lines to explain > American cruise culture to them, so improvement should be swift. They > are really trying hard. But we don’t expect they’ll ever be "plain > vanilla." If you like, by all means give them a try, but only if you > understand going in it’s going to be different, and that’s not a bad > thing.
Thank you for what sounds like a balanced and honest review, It meshes with what I saw on board and what my daugther (the aforementioned Vanessa) said about her experience on the crossing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Am I correct in understanding that "Opera" does have lounge chairs on promenade deck? That is my favorite place to sit on any cruise and a ship without a beautiful promenade with comfortable seating is no high on my list. I would love to try the "Opera" and wish MSC the very best of luck. Rick
> ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. > We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., > 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was > our 7th cruise together.
> Absolutely great and well rounded review! Thank you. I’ll be sailing on MSC OPERA next month and I’m really counting on something different than the mainstream American cruise lines. It sounds like MSC might just be the ticket. All the things that annoyed the demanding Florida passengers I will take in stride. I don’t let the small things get to me, and it sounds like you don’t as well. I think the most successful travelers are those that can roll with the punches and enjoy experiences that are different rather than the same. Isn’t that the point of traveling anyway? Too bad many American cruisers have gotten used to getting their way and having their hand held. It makes for some very unfriendly people …. and we have all come across them on cruises. One thing …. MSC Cruises does not plan to be a budget line in the US. Their prices are on the budget level now to attract customers since they are relatively unknown. They plan to offer a premium product with an Italian flair that will be a notch above Carnival, Royal Caribbean, and NCL. I imagine we will see their prices rise as they infiltrate the market and offer an alternative to Holland America and Celebrity. Thanks again for the review! Ernie
> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up.
Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC anytime soon. — Charles
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. > Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC > anytime soon. > —
Maybe Rick Sasso will get the message. –Tom
Thanks for posting your cruise review, I enjoyed reading it. You are a good writer, every entertaining. Many people may want to try this ship, but I am afraid the smoking problem will keep a lot of people away. OTOH, it may attract a few smokers. Becca <—–avoids smoke when I can… MOAGC http://www.motherofallgroupcruises.com/ Miracle in May http://www.cruisemaster.com/miracle.htm Canada – New England http://www.cruisemaster.com/carnivalFall.htm Caribbean Princess http://www.cruisemaster.com/caribprin.htm
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they >> aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning >> smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the >> restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non >> smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the >> cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night >> (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were >> fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking >> area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed >> corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light >> up. > Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC > anytime soon. > — > Maybe Rick Sasso will get the message. > –Tom
The cruises originating from the US will have a much higher percentage of Americans and Canadians which automatically means less smokers. I would imagine there will be no more smokers than on a typical Carnival cruise. I also hope Rick Sasso doesn’t "Americanize" the product to the point where it’s just another Princess or Royal Caribbean. I think that would defeat the entire marketing strategy. MSC is definitely for people looking for something beyond the mainstream. Ernie
> The cruises originating from the US will have a much higher percentage of > Americans and Canadians which automatically means less smokers. I would > imagine there will be no more smokers than on a typical Carnival cruise.
Maybe. A counter example would be Costa. It has somewhat similiar origins and from the reviews I have read of their Caribbean sailings there are more smokers than other cruise lines. Also If the Carnival cruise I was on in October is typical then a typical Carnival cruise has more second hand smoke. — Charles
> Maybe. A counter example would be Costa. It has somewhat similiar > origins and from the reviews I have read of their Caribbean sailings > there are more smokers than other cruise lines. Also If the Carnival > cruise I was on in October is typical then a typical Carnival cruise > has more second hand smoke. > — > Charles
My Carnival cruises have typically had more smokers than other cruise lines I have sailed, which is why I used them as an example. MSC sailing from the US will probably have smoker’s in the same quantity as Carnival. For me personally, this is nothing that would stop me from sailing Carnival or MSC. I’m traveling with my mom and some friends on MSC OPERA, and my mom is a smoker so I know she will be happy. Ernie
> My Carnival cruises have typically had more smokers than other cruise lines > I have sailed, which is why I used them as an example. MSC sailing from the > US will probably have smoker’s in the same quantity as Carnival. For me > personally, this is nothing that would stop me from sailing Carnival or MSC. > I’m traveling with my mom and some friends on MSC OPERA, and my mom is a > smoker so I know she will be happy.
Okay. I was not sure if Carnival typically has more smokers or there was just more smoke on the one Carnival sailing. I can live with some second hand smoke, like what I have encountered on Celebrity, Princess and RCI. The amount I encountered on Carnival was over my personal threshold, so if it turns out MSC has the same quantity as Carnival I won’t book it. — Charles
The review was quite good. My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. Smoking was not a problem in most areas. The outside patio area had most of the smokers. There is no smoking in the 2 main show lounges, the dining rooms or on the port side of the ship. Ship: Very nice. Service: At the start of the cruise, Poor. At the end of the cruise, GOOD As the other reviewer noted, they have a few things to work out. THEY WERE TRYING. This was the 1st caribbean cruise from Fort Lauderdale. I had expected some problems with service. This is normal. I was on the 1st cruise of the Mariner of the Seas. It was not as good as the Operas 1st cruise. The food in the dining rooms was Very Good. The Buffet was Fair to Poor It also was not opened every night. Has to be improved! The Casino: 2 Blackjack tables, 1 Caribbean Stud Table & 1 Holdem Table. 3 Roulette wheels. and Slot machines. VERY SMALL, No Dice table. It also was only open from 2:30 to 6:30 and 8:30 till 1AM. Shows were excellent. Some of the best I ever saw. Cabins are very nice, Shower is small. On a scale of 1 to 10, it is a 7. I would go back anytime. Brent
Terrific review, thanks. Sue
>The review was quite good. >My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. >Smoking was not a problem in most areas. >The outside patio area had most of the smokers. >There is no smoking in the 2 main show lounges, the dining rooms or on the >port side of the ship.
Someone else remarked that smokers did not adhere to that stated policy. What did you observe? Did the outside smokers stay on the smoking side or do I have to be prepared to punch out their lights if I sail on the Opera?
> The review was quite good. > My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. > Smoking was not a problem in most areas. > The outside patio area had most of the smokers.
By your description, smoking is only a problem if you want to go outside. How about a show of hands? How many people like to go out on th e deck during a cruise?
>> The review was quite good. > My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. > Smoking was not a problem in most areas. > The outside patio area had most of the smokers. >By your description, smoking is only a problem if you want to go >outside. How about a show of hands? How many people like to go out on th >e deck during a cruise?
me, me, me, me, and we, we, we, we.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. >Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC >anytime soon.
Same for us. No MSC cruises as long as they don’t maintain lots of smokefree areas, including out on deck. It’s a shame, because we are enjoy opportunities to mix and mingle with folks of other nations. And foreign languages are no obstacle, either. Between us we have several languages in which we are fluent and we are well-travelled. It’s not fair or truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys". Certain segments of some European countries include more smokers, and speaking from experience, that would likely include budget cruisers. I lived and studied among well-educated upper middle-class Germans, Austrians, Dutch and Belgians and not even one of them smoked. Neither did most of the other Europeans I knew well. We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere else in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much smoking. Do we cruise less often because of this? Yep, you betcha.
> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere else > in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much smoking.
I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. — Charles
> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere > else > in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much > smoking. > I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage > who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise > ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. > —
Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end up smoking both day and night during the cruise. –Tom
>>> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they >> aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning >> smoking. >It’s not fair or truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys". >Certain segments of some European countries include more smokers, and speaking >from experience, that would likely include budget cruisers. I lived and >studied among well-educated upper middle-class Germans, Austrians, Dutch and >Belgians and not even one of them smoked. Neither did most of the other >Europeans I knew well.
It is entirely fair and truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys," as people active in international campaigns to reduce smoking in public places can tell you. People who sailed on the Opera repositioning cruise can offer anecdotal support to the medical statistics, and we did. This doesn’t make us untruthful, it means that our experience was not what one writer expected. Our chimney-like characterization applies to offices, restaurants and public places in general. If one is fortunate enough to have spent time among a handful of European non-smokers, congratulations, so have we. Nonetheless, from a public policy point of view, the trends are clear – many European countries are way behind us in recognizing the harm in second-hand smoke, and doing anything about it. On our repositioning cruise, there were some areas of the Opera, like the restaurants, where smoking was not allowed and the prohibition was observed. There were other areas of the ship where the non-smoking signs were disregarded. If, as seems from Brent Stell’s excellent review, this is less of a problem with the winter-season Caribbean-only cruises, that’s good news. My wife is asthmatic and can’t tolerate tobacco smoke. We always found ways of working around it on our crossing, and it should be even easier now. We didn’t have room in our review to mention that you can request a non-smoker’s cabin, so you don’t have to deal with fumes from a previous passenger. If you are a militant non-smoker, as we are, don’t eliminate the Opera from consideration for that one reason. The entire ship is cleaner than most, and tobacco was a manageable problem. As a work-in-progress, I’m sure that over time the ship will become progressively more considerate to non-smokers. Dave
>We didn’t have room in our review to mention that you can request a >non-smoker’s cabin, so you don’t have to deal with fumes from a >previous passenger.
You had room to classify and entire continent of people when you said that Europeans "smoke like chimneys," yet you could not fit into your review the very important and welcome news that there is a ship that has non-smoking cabins on it? Check the size of your sentences. You DID have room. OK, it was your review, your choice, but that tidbit of information is one I would not have left out. I am glad to now learn that the MSC Opera has some cabins that don’t reek of smoke. Hopefully, there are many, spread across a wide assortment of cabin types and locations, including the most coveted. I enjoyed your review, in general. Like you, we do not tolerate smoke well, and we patronize places where we can avoid it. If MSC can provide a unique cruise experience and polices their own stated "no smoking" areas, we’ll be happy to give the line a chance.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere >> else >> in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much >> smoking. > I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage > who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise > ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. > — >Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people >who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may >find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where >smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end >up smoking both day and night during the cruise.
Kind of like werewolves get caught in the cycle of a full moon?
> Nonetheless, from a public policy point of view, the trends are clear > – many European countries are way behind us in recognizing the harm
They know about it. > in > second-hand smoke, and doing anything about it.
Is a different thing.
Certainly this is true to some extent….I know a lot of social smokers who never smoke but may have 1 or 2 in a disco, etc. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people > who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may > find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where > smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end up > smoking both day and night during the cruise. > –Tom
Please email me about your review. Thanks, Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. > We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., > 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was > our 7th cruise together. > ABOUT THE SHIP: If you have a specific idea of what cruising should be > like, with a thousand detailed requirements, you will not enjoy this > ship. It does not offer the same experience as Carnival, Royal > Caribbean or Norwegian and probably never will. If, on the other hand, > you find the interplay of cultures fascinating, and find differences > stimulating instead of just "wrong," you’ll have a wonderful time. > MSC is an Italian company. They are the second largest cargo line in > the world and are relatively new to the cruise market so there are > some good values to be had. > At least half of the passengers on our ocean crossing were Europeans > and the blessedly few PA announcements were in five languages: > English, German, Italian, French and Spanish. Service personnel must > function in most of these languages. Some do this better than others, > but all seemed pleasant and patient. > The MSC Opera is new and is a sleek greyhound. It was designed for the > luxury trade before the decision was made to pursue the budget end of > the market. The interiors are quietly elegant in dark blues, smoky > plums, corals and creams. There’s no art in particular but the > lighting fixtures are well designed like big sculptures. The ship > lacks glass-sided elevators, high atriums and Vegas-style metallic > glitz, but makes up for it by being really comfortable, human-scaled > like a good European hotel. Lots of small places to settle in. Lots of > glass and views of the sea. > We had an inside cabin. It was not the largest we’ve been in, but the > mirror layout was the best we’ve seen, giving more light and sense of > space than we expected. The bathroom was equally well-planned, > generously sized with an excellent shower. Water heat and pressure > were both good. > The smaller of the two restaurants, L’approdo, is a jewel box of red > and pink. The larger restaurant, La Caravella, is very sophisticated > in green, cream and yellow, with lots of columns and divisions so it > seems more intimate than its size would indicate. > There is a cafeteria on the top deck with indoor and outdoor > seating. The top deck also has two pools and is very lively. There > is often an excitable host screaming in 4 or 5 languages, running > incomprehensible games and contests with enthusiastic passengers, > Europop blaring on the speakers. If you want quiet, there are lounge > chairs on the Boat Deck most days and also at the stern of many of the > cabin decks. > ABOUT THE FOOD: Extraordinarily good. Northern Italian. We were on for > 17 days and they didn’t miss on a pasta or risotto once. Good pizza, > superb homemade ice cream, excellent bread, good soup. We found the > meat entrees a little lacking but others singled them out as > exceptional. You could always get a grilled sirloin or chicken if you > didn’t like the chef’s entrees. > The cakes were of the baba au rhum variety. Very airy and not > much chocolate, but plenty of variety. Lots of salads and fresh fruit, > plus fresh fruit in the rooms. > The waiters are Italian and joke a little heavily at first and > not always successfully in an attempt to charm you. On the whole they > are very good. When I expressed a preference for ice tea > and breadsticks rather than rolls, I found them waiting every > night. Luigi was an excellent waiter, Mario and Carlo excellent > maitre’d’s (and Sylvie was a superb cabin steward too.) > MSC has a policy that you don’t have to tip if you don’t want to. > This is churlish, the staff deserves it, they work hard. We followed > the policy we have always followed. We ignored management’s > guidelines and tipped what we wanted to and felt was appropriate. > THE BEST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: The intimacy and sheer livability of > the ship are the main virtues for us, but one of the most civilized > things is that they allow you to get duty free liquor and open it and > consume it in your room. They don’t seal it for the voyage so you’ll > order more from the bars like many lines do. > THE WORST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: There are two really bad things about > the ship: > 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. > Some Americans complained to the offenders but many of the smokers > didn’t speak English, so it was futile. We never saw staff do anything > to enforce the no-smoking areas. I am asthmatic and suffer from smoke, > but I was able to get away from it OK. Judge for yourself whether it > makes a difference to you. > 2) MANAGEMENT: Charming but utterly chaotic. Generally inefficient and > sometimes maddeningly so and in odd ways. The loading of the ship in > Genoa, for example, was the most efficient I have ever seen. You > checked in, reserved your dining table, and booked your shore > excursions in one very smooth line. But once on board, both the > purser’s and excursion desks were uninformed and uncoordinated. > For example, we tried to book a transfer from the dock to Ft. > Lauderdale airport. Reception said Shore Excursions handled that, > Shore Excursions said Reception handled that, they bounced us back and > forth, called each other and yelled into the phone. We eventually did > get to the airport and make our flight, but a little more coordination > would have worked wonders with the experience. > Similarly the 24 hour internet service broke down periodically because > the satellite gave them problems. Nobody had any idea when it would be > fixed. There is a technician on board but service remained unreliable. > Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a > barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed > the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was > an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved > 24 hours later. > THE PEOPLE ON BOARD: The Americans on board this repositioning cruise > were largely retired people, many from Florida. They are very > experienced budget cruisers. They have taken every line and they have > very set expectations about what they like and want from a cruise. > When they don’t get what they are used to from Carnival, Royal > Caribbean, etc., they don’t perceive this European ship as different, > they perceive it as WRONG! This makes some of them very hostile. > For example, there are only small cups of ice water on a hot day. > Not spigots of iced tea or fruit juice like on other ships. There is > iced tea but only in the dining rooms. Not in the cafeteria or on the > outdoor patio. This one thing made a lot of people hostile. (Until > management gets around to this one, bring a tall insulated mug and > make your own). > We were told there is little music for ballroom dancing at night. Only > disco (I guess their Mediterranean cruises have more young people > -Europeans have longer vacations than us and the American passengers > skewed older). > There are movies on the TV but they are dubbed in many languages. And > the English-language originals are often not on at convenient times, > nor are the schedules reliable. "Welcome to Mooseport" loses something > when dubbed in German (I’m not kidding). > And some passengers just don’t like it when they are so many people > on board that they can’t talk to, and they grow impatient when > instructions have to be translated. Also, some cultures are trained to > get on line, while others just crowd in, which makes for conflict. If > management would put rope lines like a bank in front of the reception > counter, that might defuse a lot of bad feeling. > We read some hostile reviews of this ship and its sister ship, > the Lirica before we booked this, but we must say we enjoyed the > experience thoroughly and found it a phenomenal value. You just have > to know what you are getting in to. > SHOPS: Very tasteful and very expensive, which made no sense at all. > The shops were one part of the ship not recalibrated for budget > cruising. The stock was entirely for the European market, the wrong > weight clothing and not even in American sizes. They didn’t sell > bottles of aspirin or Tylenol, but did sell several kinds of expensive > anti-cellulite cream. Considering the average age and needs of the > Caribbean cruisers this is pretty odd. Also, one lone bottle of SPF > sunblock shared shelf space with plentiful supplies of old-fashioned > tanning butter. > If they sold some insulated mugs with the ship’s logo, they’d clean up > and stop the no iced tea hostility, but they are not yet that > sensible. The $350 dollar sweaters didn’t sell even at 50% off. When > the temperature outside went to 90 degrees, people wanted tee shirts. > They only had a few, they were expensive and for sale only in the > liquor store! A simple $29 item in the jewelry shop would have sold > out. But they didn’t have anything at all in that category. > SHORE EXCURSIONS: The stops on our crossing were: Barcelona, > Casablanca, Funchal, Barbados, Antigua, Tortola, St. Maarten, and > Nassau. Generally
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ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was our 7th cruise together. ABOUT THE SHIP: If you have a specific idea of what cruising should be like, with a thousand detailed requirements, you will not enjoy this ship. It does not offer the same experience as Carnival, Royal Caribbean or Norwegian and probably never will. If, on the other hand, you find the interplay of cultures fascinating, and find differences stimulating instead of just "wrong," you’ll have a wonderful time. MSC is an Italian company. They are the second largest cargo line in the world and are relatively new to the cruise market so there are some good values to be had. At least half of the passengers on our ocean crossing were Europeans and the blessedly few PA announcements were in five languages: English, German, Italian, French and Spanish. Service personnel must function in most of these languages. Some do this better than others, but all seemed pleasant and patient. The MSC Opera is new and is a sleek greyhound. It was designed for the luxury trade before the decision was made to pursue the budget end of the market. The interiors are quietly elegant in dark blues, smoky plums, corals and creams. There’s no art in particular but the lighting fixtures are well designed like big sculptures. The ship lacks glass-sided elevators, high atriums and Vegas-style metallic glitz, but makes up for it by being really comfortable, human-scaled like a good European hotel. Lots of small places to settle in. Lots of glass and views of the sea. We had an inside cabin. It was not the largest we’ve been in, but the mirror layout was the best we’ve seen, giving more light and sense of space than we expected. The bathroom was equally well-planned, generously sized with an excellent shower. Water heat and pressure were both good. The smaller of the two restaurants, L’approdo, is a jewel box of red and pink. The larger restaurant, La Caravella, is very sophisticated in green, cream and yellow, with lots of columns and divisions so it seems more intimate than its size would indicate. There is a cafeteria on the top deck with indoor and outdoor seating. The top deck also has two pools and is very lively. There is often an excitable host screaming in 4 or 5 languages, running incomprehensible games and contests with enthusiastic passengers, Europop blaring on the speakers. If you want quiet, there are lounge chairs on the Boat Deck most days and also at the stern of many of the cabin decks. ABOUT THE FOOD: Extraordinarily good. Northern Italian. We were on for 17 days and they didn’t miss on a pasta or risotto once. Good pizza, superb homemade ice cream, excellent bread, good soup. We found the meat entrees a little lacking but others singled them out as exceptional. You could always get a grilled sirloin or chicken if you didn’t like the chef’s entrees. The cakes were of the baba au rhum variety. Very airy and not much chocolate, but plenty of variety. Lots of salads and fresh fruit, plus fresh fruit in the rooms. The waiters are Italian and joke a little heavily at first and not always successfully in an attempt to charm you. On the whole they are very good. When I expressed a preference for ice tea and breadsticks rather than rolls, I found them waiting every night. Luigi was an excellent waiter, Mario and Carlo excellent maitre’d’s (and Sylvie was a superb cabin steward too.) MSC has a policy that you don’t have to tip if you don’t want to. This is churlish, the staff deserves it, they work hard. We followed the policy we have always followed. We ignored management’s guidelines and tipped what we wanted to and felt was appropriate. THE BEST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: The intimacy and sheer livability of the ship are the main virtues for us, but one of the most civilized things is that they allow you to get duty free liquor and open it and consume it in your room. They don’t seal it for the voyage so you’ll order more from the bars like many lines do. THE WORST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: There are two really bad things about the ship: 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light up. Some Americans complained to the offenders but many of the smokers didn’t speak English, so it was futile. We never saw staff do anything to enforce the no-smoking areas. I am asthmatic and suffer from smoke, but I was able to get away from it OK. Judge for yourself whether it makes a difference to you. 2) MANAGEMENT: Charming but utterly chaotic. Generally inefficient and sometimes maddeningly so and in odd ways. The loading of the ship in Genoa, for example, was the most efficient I have ever seen. You checked in, reserved your dining table, and booked your shore excursions in one very smooth line. But once on board, both the purser’s and excursion desks were uninformed and uncoordinated. For example, we tried to book a transfer from the dock to Ft. Lauderdale airport. Reception said Shore Excursions handled that, Shore Excursions said Reception handled that, they bounced us back and forth, called each other and yelled into the phone. We eventually did get to the airport and make our flight, but a little more coordination would have worked wonders with the experience. Similarly the 24 hour internet service broke down periodically because the satellite gave them problems. Nobody had any idea when it would be fixed. There is a technician on board but service remained unreliable. Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved 24 hours later. THE PEOPLE ON BOARD: The Americans on board this repositioning cruise were largely retired people, many from Florida. They are very experienced budget cruisers. They have taken every line and they have very set expectations about what they like and want from a cruise. When they don’t get what they are used to from Carnival, Royal Caribbean, etc., they don’t perceive this European ship as different, they perceive it as WRONG! This makes some of them very hostile. For example, there are only small cups of ice water on a hot day. Not spigots of iced tea or fruit juice like on other ships. There is iced tea but only in the dining rooms. Not in the cafeteria or on the outdoor patio. This one thing made a lot of people hostile. (Until management gets around to this one, bring a tall insulated mug and make your own). We were told there is little music for ballroom dancing at night. Only disco (I guess their Mediterranean cruises have more young people -Europeans have longer vacations than us and the American passengers skewed older). There are movies on the TV but they are dubbed in many languages. And the English-language originals are often not on at convenient times, nor are the schedules reliable. "Welcome to Mooseport" loses something when dubbed in German (I’m not kidding). And some passengers just don’t like it when they are so many people on board that they can’t talk to, and they grow impatient when instructions have to be translated. Also, some cultures are trained to get on line, while others just crowd in, which makes for conflict. If management would put rope lines like a bank in front of the reception counter, that might defuse a lot of bad feeling. We read some hostile reviews of this ship and its sister ship, the Lirica before we booked this, but we must say we enjoyed the experience thoroughly and found it a phenomenal value. You just have to know what you are getting in to. SHOPS: Very tasteful and very expensive, which made no sense at all. The shops were one part of the ship not recalibrated for budget cruising. The stock was entirely for the European market, the wrong weight clothing and not even in American sizes. They didn’t sell bottles of aspirin or Tylenol, but did sell several kinds of expensive anti-cellulite cream. Considering the average age and needs of the Caribbean cruisers this is pretty odd. Also, one lone bottle of SPF sunblock shared shelf space with plentiful supplies of old-fashioned tanning butter. If they sold some insulated mugs with the ship’s logo, they’d clean up and stop the no iced tea hostility, but they are not yet that sensible. The $350 dollar sweaters didn’t sell even at 50% off. When the temperature outside went to 90 degrees, people wanted tee shirts. They only had a few, they were expensive and for sale only in the liquor store! A simple $29 item in the jewelry shop would have sold out. But they didn’t have anything at all in that category. SHORE EXCURSIONS: The stops on our crossing were: Barcelona, Casablanca, Funchal, Barbados, Antigua, Tortola, St. Maarten, and Nassau. Generally well run. Remember to bring Euros for Barcelona and Funchal (not all the Americans on board did). The ship charges 3 percent to change money. This includes 3 percent to cash travelers checks which is a bum deal. They’re supposed to be cash. The full day excursion to Marrakesh from Casablanca which includes a 4 hour bus trip both ways is exhausting but sooo worth it! Don’t miss this one. In Madeira, we found riding a wicker … read more »
ervice remained unreliable. > Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a > barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed > the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was > an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved > 24 hours later.
I will be sure to relay that message to Vanessa and her roomate Amanda Not that I am a proud father or anything! > HOPE FOR THE FUTURE: > MSC has hired management from American cruise lines to explain > American cruise culture to them, so improvement should be swift. They > are really trying hard. But we don’t expect they’ll ever be "plain > vanilla." If you like, by all means give them a try, but only if you > understand going in it’s going to be different, and that’s not a bad > thing.
Thank you for what sounds like a balanced and honest review, It meshes with what I saw on board and what my daugther (the aforementioned Vanessa) said about her experience on the crossing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Am I correct in understanding that "Opera" does have lounge chairs on promenade deck? That is my favorite place to sit on any cruise and a ship without a beautiful promenade with comfortable seating is no high on my list. I would love to try the "Opera" and wish MSC the very best of luck. Rick
> ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. > We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., > 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was > our 7th cruise together.
> Absolutely great and well rounded review! Thank you. I’ll be sailing on MSC OPERA next month and I’m really counting on something different than the mainstream American cruise lines. It sounds like MSC might just be the ticket. All the things that annoyed the demanding Florida passengers I will take in stride. I don’t let the small things get to me, and it sounds like you don’t as well. I think the most successful travelers are those that can roll with the punches and enjoy experiences that are different rather than the same. Isn’t that the point of traveling anyway? Too bad many American cruisers have gotten used to getting their way and having their hand held. It makes for some very unfriendly people …. and we have all come across them on cruises. One thing …. MSC Cruises does not plan to be a budget line in the US. Their prices are on the budget level now to attract customers since they are relatively unknown. They plan to offer a premium product with an Italian flair that will be a notch above Carnival, Royal Caribbean, and NCL. I imagine we will see their prices rise as they infiltrate the market and offer an alternative to Holland America and Celebrity. Thanks again for the review! Ernie
> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up.
Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC anytime soon. — Charles
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. > Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC > anytime soon. > —
Maybe Rick Sasso will get the message. –Tom
Thanks for posting your cruise review, I enjoyed reading it. You are a good writer, every entertaining. Many people may want to try this ship, but I am afraid the smoking problem will keep a lot of people away. OTOH, it may attract a few smokers. Becca <—–avoids smoke when I can… MOAGC http://www.motherofallgroupcruises.com/ Miracle in May http://www.cruisemaster.com/miracle.htm Canada – New England http://www.cruisemaster.com/carnivalFall.htm Caribbean Princess http://www.cruisemaster.com/caribprin.htm
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they >> aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning >> smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the >> restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non >> smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the >> cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night >> (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were >> fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking >> area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed >> corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light >> up. > Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC > anytime soon. > — > Maybe Rick Sasso will get the message. > –Tom
The cruises originating from the US will have a much higher percentage of Americans and Canadians which automatically means less smokers. I would imagine there will be no more smokers than on a typical Carnival cruise. I also hope Rick Sasso doesn’t "Americanize" the product to the point where it’s just another Princess or Royal Caribbean. I think that would defeat the entire marketing strategy. MSC is definitely for people looking for something beyond the mainstream. Ernie
> The cruises originating from the US will have a much higher percentage of > Americans and Canadians which automatically means less smokers. I would > imagine there will be no more smokers than on a typical Carnival cruise.
Maybe. A counter example would be Costa. It has somewhat similiar origins and from the reviews I have read of their Caribbean sailings there are more smokers than other cruise lines. Also If the Carnival cruise I was on in October is typical then a typical Carnival cruise has more second hand smoke. — Charles
> Maybe. A counter example would be Costa. It has somewhat similiar > origins and from the reviews I have read of their Caribbean sailings > there are more smokers than other cruise lines. Also If the Carnival > cruise I was on in October is typical then a typical Carnival cruise > has more second hand smoke. > — > Charles
My Carnival cruises have typically had more smokers than other cruise lines I have sailed, which is why I used them as an example. MSC sailing from the US will probably have smoker’s in the same quantity as Carnival. For me personally, this is nothing that would stop me from sailing Carnival or MSC. I’m traveling with my mom and some friends on MSC OPERA, and my mom is a smoker so I know she will be happy. Ernie
> My Carnival cruises have typically had more smokers than other cruise lines > I have sailed, which is why I used them as an example. MSC sailing from the > US will probably have smoker’s in the same quantity as Carnival. For me > personally, this is nothing that would stop me from sailing Carnival or MSC. > I’m traveling with my mom and some friends on MSC OPERA, and my mom is a > smoker so I know she will be happy.
Okay. I was not sure if Carnival typically has more smokers or there was just more smoke on the one Carnival sailing. I can live with some second hand smoke, like what I have encountered on Celebrity, Princess and RCI. The amount I encountered on Carnival was over my personal threshold, so if it turns out MSC has the same quantity as Carnival I won’t book it. — Charles
The review was quite good. My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. Smoking was not a problem in most areas. The outside patio area had most of the smokers. There is no smoking in the 2 main show lounges, the dining rooms or on the port side of the ship. Ship: Very nice. Service: At the start of the cruise, Poor. At the end of the cruise, GOOD As the other reviewer noted, they have a few things to work out. THEY WERE TRYING. This was the 1st caribbean cruise from Fort Lauderdale. I had expected some problems with service. This is normal. I was on the 1st cruise of the Mariner of the Seas. It was not as good as the Operas 1st cruise. The food in the dining rooms was Very Good. The Buffet was Fair to Poor It also was not opened every night. Has to be improved! The Casino: 2 Blackjack tables, 1 Caribbean Stud Table & 1 Holdem Table. 3 Roulette wheels. and Slot machines. VERY SMALL, No Dice table. It also was only open from 2:30 to 6:30 and 8:30 till 1AM. Shows were excellent. Some of the best I ever saw. Cabins are very nice, Shower is small. On a scale of 1 to 10, it is a 7. I would go back anytime. Brent
Terrific review, thanks. Sue
>The review was quite good. >My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. >Smoking was not a problem in most areas. >The outside patio area had most of the smokers. >There is no smoking in the 2 main show lounges, the dining rooms or on the >port side of the ship.
Someone else remarked that smokers did not adhere to that stated policy. What did you observe? Did the outside smokers stay on the smoking side or do I have to be prepared to punch out their lights if I sail on the Opera?
> The review was quite good. > My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. > Smoking was not a problem in most areas. > The outside patio area had most of the smokers.
By your description, smoking is only a problem if you want to go outside. How about a show of hands? How many people like to go out on th e deck during a cruise?
>> The review was quite good. > My review is on the 7 night cruise Dec. 4, 2004. > Smoking was not a problem in most areas. > The outside patio area had most of the smokers. >By your description, smoking is only a problem if you want to go >outside. How about a show of hands? How many people like to go out on th >e deck during a cruise?
me, me, me, me, and we, we, we, we.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. >Thanks for the review. The above scratches the idea that I will try MSC >anytime soon.
Same for us. No MSC cruises as long as they don’t maintain lots of smokefree areas, including out on deck. It’s a shame, because we are enjoy opportunities to mix and mingle with folks of other nations. And foreign languages are no obstacle, either. Between us we have several languages in which we are fluent and we are well-travelled. It’s not fair or truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys". Certain segments of some European countries include more smokers, and speaking from experience, that would likely include budget cruisers. I lived and studied among well-educated upper middle-class Germans, Austrians, Dutch and Belgians and not even one of them smoked. Neither did most of the other Europeans I knew well. We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere else in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much smoking. Do we cruise less often because of this? Yep, you betcha.
> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere else > in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much smoking.
I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. — Charles
> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere > else > in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much > smoking. > I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage > who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise > ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. > —
Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end up smoking both day and night during the cruise. –Tom
>>> 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they >> aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning >> smoking. >It’s not fair or truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys". >Certain segments of some European countries include more smokers, and speaking >from experience, that would likely include budget cruisers. I lived and >studied among well-educated upper middle-class Germans, Austrians, Dutch and >Belgians and not even one of them smoked. Neither did most of the other >Europeans I knew well.
It is entirely fair and truthful to say that Europeans "smoke like chimneys," as people active in international campaigns to reduce smoking in public places can tell you. People who sailed on the Opera repositioning cruise can offer anecdotal support to the medical statistics, and we did. This doesn’t make us untruthful, it means that our experience was not what one writer expected. Our chimney-like characterization applies to offices, restaurants and public places in general. If one is fortunate enough to have spent time among a handful of European non-smokers, congratulations, so have we. Nonetheless, from a public policy point of view, the trends are clear – many European countries are way behind us in recognizing the harm in second-hand smoke, and doing anything about it. On our repositioning cruise, there were some areas of the Opera, like the restaurants, where smoking was not allowed and the prohibition was observed. There were other areas of the ship where the non-smoking signs were disregarded. If, as seems from Brent Stell’s excellent review, this is less of a problem with the winter-season Caribbean-only cruises, that’s good news. My wife is asthmatic and can’t tolerate tobacco smoke. We always found ways of working around it on our crossing, and it should be even easier now. We didn’t have room in our review to mention that you can request a non-smoker’s cabin, so you don’t have to deal with fumes from a previous passenger. If you are a militant non-smoker, as we are, don’t eliminate the Opera from consideration for that one reason. The entire ship is cleaner than most, and tobacco was a manageable problem. As a work-in-progress, I’m sure that over time the ship will become progressively more considerate to non-smokers. Dave
>We didn’t have room in our review to mention that you can request a >non-smoker’s cabin, so you don’t have to deal with fumes from a >previous passenger.
You had room to classify and entire continent of people when you said that Europeans "smoke like chimneys," yet you could not fit into your review the very important and welcome news that there is a ship that has non-smoking cabins on it? Check the size of your sentences. You DID have room. OK, it was your review, your choice, but that tidbit of information is one I would not have left out. I am glad to now learn that the MSC Opera has some cabins that don’t reek of smoke. Hopefully, there are many, spread across a wide assortment of cabin types and locations, including the most coveted. I enjoyed your review, in general. Like you, we do not tolerate smoke well, and we patronize places where we can avoid it. If MSC can provide a unique cruise experience and polices their own stated "no smoking" areas, we’ll be happy to give the line a chance.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> We notice significantly more adult smokers on cruises than we do anywhere >> else >> in our daily lives, and maybe it is because ships still permit so much >> smoking. > I think there are somewhat more smokers on cruises than the percentage > who smoke in the general population and it probably is because cruise > ships are one of the last refuges of smokers. > — >Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people >who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may >find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where >smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end >up smoking both day and night during the cruise.
Kind of like werewolves get caught in the cycle of a full moon?
> Nonetheless, from a public policy point of view, the trends are clear > – many European countries are way behind us in recognizing the harm
They know about it. > in > second-hand smoke, and doing anything about it.
Is a different thing.
Certainly this is true to some extent….I know a lot of social smokers who never smoke but may have 1 or 2 in a disco, etc. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Also, it could be more of a "pattern of behavior" type place. Many people > who don’t smoke regularly, or at least not frequently during the day, may > find themselves in night clubs, discos, casinos, etc., each evening, where > smoking is more frequently found. They get caught in the cycle and end up > smoking both day and night during the cruise. > –Tom
Please email me about your review. Thanks, Mary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > ABOUT US: We are 55 and 60 years old, and have traveled extensively. > We took the Westbound Transatlantic crossing of the Opera in Nov., > 2004, starting in Genoa, Italy and ending in Ft. Lauderdale. This was > our 7th cruise together. > ABOUT THE SHIP: If you have a specific idea of what cruising should be > like, with a thousand detailed requirements, you will not enjoy this > ship. It does not offer the same experience as Carnival, Royal > Caribbean or Norwegian and probably never will. If, on the other hand, > you find the interplay of cultures fascinating, and find differences > stimulating instead of just "wrong," you’ll have a wonderful time. > MSC is an Italian company. They are the second largest cargo line in > the world and are relatively new to the cruise market so there are > some good values to be had. > At least half of the passengers on our ocean crossing were Europeans > and the blessedly few PA announcements were in five languages: > English, German, Italian, French and Spanish. Service personnel must > function in most of these languages. Some do this better than others, > but all seemed pleasant and patient. > The MSC Opera is new and is a sleek greyhound. It was designed for the > luxury trade before the decision was made to pursue the budget end of > the market. The interiors are quietly elegant in dark blues, smoky > plums, corals and creams. There’s no art in particular but the > lighting fixtures are well designed like big sculptures. The ship > lacks glass-sided elevators, high atriums and Vegas-style metallic > glitz, but makes up for it by being really comfortable, human-scaled > like a good European hotel. Lots of small places to settle in. Lots of > glass and views of the sea. > We had an inside cabin. It was not the largest we’ve been in, but the > mirror layout was the best we’ve seen, giving more light and sense of > space than we expected. The bathroom was equally well-planned, > generously sized with an excellent shower. Water heat and pressure > were both good. > The smaller of the two restaurants, L’approdo, is a jewel box of red > and pink. The larger restaurant, La Caravella, is very sophisticated > in green, cream and yellow, with lots of columns and divisions so it > seems more intimate than its size would indicate. > There is a cafeteria on the top deck with indoor and outdoor > seating. The top deck also has two pools and is very lively. There > is often an excitable host screaming in 4 or 5 languages, running > incomprehensible games and contests with enthusiastic passengers, > Europop blaring on the speakers. If you want quiet, there are lounge > chairs on the Boat Deck most days and also at the stern of many of the > cabin decks. > ABOUT THE FOOD: Extraordinarily good. Northern Italian. We were on for > 17 days and they didn’t miss on a pasta or risotto once. Good pizza, > superb homemade ice cream, excellent bread, good soup. We found the > meat entrees a little lacking but others singled them out as > exceptional. You could always get a grilled sirloin or chicken if you > didn’t like the chef’s entrees. > The cakes were of the baba au rhum variety. Very airy and not > much chocolate, but plenty of variety. Lots of salads and fresh fruit, > plus fresh fruit in the rooms. > The waiters are Italian and joke a little heavily at first and > not always successfully in an attempt to charm you. On the whole they > are very good. When I expressed a preference for ice tea > and breadsticks rather than rolls, I found them waiting every > night. Luigi was an excellent waiter, Mario and Carlo excellent > maitre’d’s (and Sylvie was a superb cabin steward too.) > MSC has a policy that you don’t have to tip if you don’t want to. > This is churlish, the staff deserves it, they work hard. We followed > the policy we have always followed. We ignored management’s > guidelines and tipped what we wanted to and felt was appropriate. > THE BEST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: The intimacy and sheer livability of > the ship are the main virtues for us, but one of the most civilized > things is that they allow you to get duty free liquor and open it and > consume it in your room. They don’t seal it for the voyage so you’ll > order more from the bars like many lines do. > THE WORST THING ABOUT THE SHIP: There are two really bad things about > the ship: > 1) SMOKING: Many Europeans smoke. Like chimneys. And seemingly they > aren’t even aware it might hurt others. They are behind us on banning > smoking. Fortunately they were not allowed to smoke inside the > restaurants, but the outdoor patio area was rendered unusable for non > smokers. This was a big disappointment to us, but didn’t ruin the > cruise. We don’t go to the lounges at night > (we like to get up for the dawn) but we understand there were > fights in the lounges about people who ignored the non-smoking > area designations. And there’s nothing like being in a jammed > corridor trying to exit the ship in a port and having someone light > up. > Some Americans complained to the offenders but many of the smokers > didn’t speak English, so it was futile. We never saw staff do anything > to enforce the no-smoking areas. I am asthmatic and suffer from smoke, > but I was able to get away from it OK. Judge for yourself whether it > makes a difference to you. > 2) MANAGEMENT: Charming but utterly chaotic. Generally inefficient and > sometimes maddeningly so and in odd ways. The loading of the ship in > Genoa, for example, was the most efficient I have ever seen. You > checked in, reserved your dining table, and booked your shore > excursions in one very smooth line. But once on board, both the > purser’s and excursion desks were uninformed and uncoordinated. > For example, we tried to book a transfer from the dock to Ft. > Lauderdale airport. Reception said Shore Excursions handled that, > Shore Excursions said Reception handled that, they bounced us back and > forth, called each other and yelled into the phone. We eventually did > get to the airport and make our flight, but a little more coordination > would have worked wonders with the experience. > Similarly the 24 hour internet service broke down periodically because > the satellite gave them problems. Nobody had any idea when it would be > fixed. There is a technician on board but service remained unreliable. > Our two valiant American hostesses, Amanda and Vanessa, bravely took a > barrage of passenger criticism, justified and otherwise, and relayed > the complaints to management. Often the response from the bridge was > an automatic "no," but then the problem would be mysteriously solved > 24 hours later. > THE PEOPLE ON BOARD: The Americans on board this repositioning cruise > were largely retired people, many from Florida. They are very > experienced budget cruisers. They have taken every line and they have > very set expectations about what they like and want from a cruise. > When they don’t get what they are used to from Carnival, Royal > Caribbean, etc., they don’t perceive this European ship as different, > they perceive it as WRONG! This makes some of them very hostile. > For example, there are only small cups of ice water on a hot day. > Not spigots of iced tea or fruit juice like on other ships. There is > iced tea but only in the dining rooms. Not in the cafeteria or on the > outdoor patio. This one thing made a lot of people hostile. (Until > management gets around to this one, bring a tall insulated mug and > make your own). > We were told there is little music for ballroom dancing at night. Only > disco (I guess their Mediterranean cruises have more young people > -Europeans have longer vacations than us and the American passengers > skewed older). > There are movies on the TV but they are dubbed in many languages. And > the English-language originals are often not on at convenient times, > nor are the schedules reliable. "Welcome to Mooseport" loses something > when dubbed in German (I’m not kidding). > And some passengers just don’t like it when they are so many people > on board that they can’t talk to, and they grow impatient when > instructions have to be translated. Also, some cultures are trained to > get on line, while others just crowd in, which makes for conflict. If > management would put rope lines like a bank in front of the reception > counter, that might defuse a lot of bad feeling. > We read some hostile reviews of this ship and its sister ship, > the Lirica before we booked this, but we must say we enjoyed the > experience thoroughly and found it a phenomenal value. You just have > to know what you are getting in to. > SHOPS: Very tasteful and very expensive, which made no sense at all. > The shops were one part of the ship not recalibrated for budget > cruising. The stock was entirely for the European market, the wrong > weight clothing and not even in American sizes. They didn’t sell > bottles of aspirin or Tylenol, but did sell several kinds of expensive > anti-cellulite cream. Considering the average age and needs of the > Caribbean cruisers this is pretty odd. Also, one lone bottle of SPF > sunblock shared shelf space with plentiful supplies of old-fashioned > tanning butter. > If they sold some insulated mugs with the ship’s logo, they’d clean up > and stop the no iced tea hostility, but they are not yet that > sensible. The $350 dollar sweaters didn’t sell even at 50% off. When > the temperature outside went to 90 degrees, people wanted tee shirts. > They only had a few, they were expensive and for sale only in the > liquor store! A simple $29 item in the jewelry shop would have sold > out. But they didn’t have anything at all in that category. > SHORE EXCURSIONS: The stops on our crossing were: Barcelona, > Casablanca, Funchal, Barbados, Antigua, Tortola, St. Maarten, and > Nassau. Generally
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My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we would like to see as much as possible, as we have only 7 days to do it in.Thanks in advance for any help. Chad
If you only have 7 days, I strongly recommend a round trip. The travel time to or from Anchorage will consume many many more hours and dollars than the similar travel to or from Vancouver. Look for a cruise that includes Glacier Bay — it is the star attraction and not all cruises go there. KK – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. > I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, > a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we > would like to see as much as possible, as we have only 7 days to do it > in.Thanks in advance for any help. > Chad
I should have explained better I have 7 nights for the cruise itself , I can take a few extra days to travel to and from Detroit if I need it.Thanks in advance. Chad
>My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. >I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, >a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we >would like to see as muc
I would go the earliest possible in Sept as the bad weather factor multiplies as the month goes on. I wouldn’t consider a one way for my self without at least 5 additional interior touring days. It is such a long and expensive trip to get there that I want to make the most of it. If you do want a one way, I would go south- again for the weather factor. But don’t think round trips are shortchanging your self, they offer a lot in 7 days, 3 ports and a glacier same as the one ways. I also highly recommend Glacier Bay- my clear preference. More ships go into the Bay in Sept as they are outside the permit restrictions- at least I know that Carnival goes in???
Hi Chad, I too am doing my first Alaska cruise on Aug. 30 to Sept. 6th on Celebrity Infinity, its doing an inside passage. In case you want to check it out, here is the link: http://www.cruisemates.com/Articles/CMcruises/alaska2002.cfm I believe after this one, there will be 2 more Alaska cruises for this ship before heading south. Hope you find the right cruise for you. Donna Tuesday Chat Host http://www.cruisemates.com
I am from Italy and i think to booking a 7 night cruise from Seattle to Alaska (roundtrip) in July 18, 2004. My preferred ship is Sapphire Princess and i find the best price at this internet travel agency: http://www.awcv.com/ It’s a good TA ? Someone of you had book a cruise with this TA ? Please write me your experience. Thanks in advance Frank
Be aware that this route has a lot of outside passage sailing compared to some Vancouver departures. The more inside the better in my experience. 
(my opinion only).
My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! Teresa
Teresa, I’ve used Princess and did the 7 day tour and 7 day cruise. Alaska is incredible and if oyu can afford the time & money try to do the tour too. I picked Princess before I had cruised with them before and felt they gave good value for the money. You can go to their website 7 get info. Norma
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be >probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has >taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that >ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" >stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to >contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! >Teresa
Far more important than a specific line should be the route- ports, and glacier as most of what you should go to Alaska for is OUTSIDE the ship. :) I have cruised Alaska 9 times. I also DO NOT recommend a cruise tour. Very fixed schedule that glosses over the tourist areas. You can see more on your own for 1/2 the costs. None go far enough into Denali – I recommend at least to Eielson.
> I had the opposite experience with my 7-day Princess cruise earlier > this month. Princess botched pretty much everything under their > direct control; the shore excursions were generally OK, though (and > one was excellent). I would NOT recommend them. YMMV.
My experience on four Princess cruises is that they do not botch anything. They have been the best of all the lines doing things right, including the small details. I would recommend Princess over the other cruise lines.
> My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be > probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has > taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that > ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" > stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to > contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! > Teresa
We took a cruise from Vancouver to Seward on the Ryndam (Holland America Lines) this past June. The ship and service were first rate and we highly recommend this ship and HAL for those who like a quiet, subdued, and elegant atmosphere. As others have attested to in this newsgroup, HAL caters to the more sedate crowd, and if you’re looking for lots of nightlife, this might not be the line for you. We also took a four day land tour to Anchorage, Denali, and Fairbanks following the cruise, and although we enjoyed it very much, our opinion is that the Westours branch of HAL, which arranges and leads such tours, is not quite up to the excellent standards of effiency that we saw on the ship. For example, there were not enough busses waiting at the dock in Seward to accomodate all the people on our particular tour and some folks had to wait for an additional bus to arrive. On the other hand, the activities and sights were well worth it and we didn’t regret having signed up for the land tour as well as the cruise. Naomi
HOLLAND AMERICA has retractable pool cover – nice in Alaska climate.
> >HOLLAND AMERICA has retractable pool cover – nice in Alaska climate. > Indeed, it was VERY nice. The Westerdam has no balcony cabins, > though. I think, if we should ever go to Alaska on a cruise again, I > would like a balcony cabin.
Its the reason I didnt choose that ship for my Panama Cruise… despite the fact i liked its ports better… I went with the Maasdam… was very happy too ! jay Sun, Jul 22, 2001 > Karen > http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > (and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)
– Legend insists that as he finished his abject… Galileo muttered under his breath: "Nevertheless, it does move."
I’ve cruised Alaska 7 times and my advice would be to go on one of the adventure cruiselines like Clipper or Alaska Sightweeing. They have very small ships, have no onboard night life. they spend the nights in various ports and local entertainers come onboard. The cruises have no casinos, they are designed to really see Alaska. They carry historians and naturalists and in Alaska, Clipper brings a native totem carver onboard. An independent tour into either Denali or the Kenai Peninsula before or after the cruise would make it an ideal trip. The advantage of the small ship over the large one is the ability to go where the large ship can’t go and the ability to follow more wildlife. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be > probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has > taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that > ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" > stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to > contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! > Teresa > We took a cruise from Vancouver to Seward on the Ryndam (Holland > America Lines) this past June. The ship and service were first rate > and we highly recommend this ship and HAL for those who like a quiet, > subdued, and elegant atmosphere. As others have attested to in this > newsgroup, HAL caters to the more sedate crowd, and if you’re looking > for lots of nightlife, this might not be the line for you. > We also took a four day land tour to Anchorage, Denali, and Fairbanks > following the cruise, and although we enjoyed it very much, our > opinion is that the Westours branch of HAL, which arranges and leads > such tours, is not quite up to the excellent standards of effiency > that we saw on the ship. For example, there were not enough busses > waiting at the dock in Seward to accomodate all the people on our > particular tour and some folks had to wait for an additional bus to > arrive. > On the other hand, the activities and sights were well worth it and we > didn’t regret having signed up for the land tour as well as the > cruise. > Naomi
I have the Radiance booked for August of next year….but, unfortunately will need to postpone that trip…anyway, I hear the Radiance is a gorgeous ship and has LOTS of glass to view the beauty of Alaska. Besides that, she’s brand-spanking new!
I don’t like viewing through glass except in the dining room (fortunate to have a window table on the Rhapsody when that ship was "new"). Only a front open deck for me. :)
Princess does wonderful things in Alaska. There are several ships and itineraries to choose from. To read our reviews and see our pictures go to http://www.elite.net/~thehalls/cruising.html Mike
Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions would be appreciated.
>Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise >Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when >school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more >rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible >on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the >dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions >would be appreciated.
Weather is unpredictable; however, we sailed in Alaska in late-May one year and it was beautiful–more snow on the distant mountains and not terribly cold nor rainy. The only time during our cruise that I considered it "cold" was when we were viewing the glacier up close and spent most of the day outside on deck. Before we arrived at the glacier it was sunny and warm. The key is to dress in layers (add or subtract as necessary), have a cap to cover your ears, and at least light gloves. You won’t find any large cruise lines that outright bar children but you might want to look into some that don’t necessarily have very many on board. As a rule, they are the more upscale lines such as Crystal and Radisson. Seven Seas. Yes, later seating generally means fewer small children. Either that, or possibly some of the smaller soft expedition type ships like Cruise West. Hope this helps. —– Linda Coffman Cruise Diva http://cruisediva.com "The best islands in the world are the ones that float and move. They’re called cruise ships."
There are never as many kids on an Alaska cruise as there are on a Caribbean cruise. I remember sailing to Alaska on Princess when my daughter was a young teenager. She was the only kid onboard. The last time I sailed to Alaska was on Celebrity’s Galaxy and there were only 144 kids of all ages on the ship, a veery small percentage. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
I live in Anchorage. Come in May instead of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves are coming out and the air is crisp. And you get here before everyone in the tour industry is tuckered out and get grouchy !!! Alaska is the vacation of a lifetime, please come on up.
thank you for responding to my inquiry.
hiya! I think if you pick a trip longer than 7 days, you will have fewer kids onboard, (definitely do not pick less than 7 days) also if you check the pricing on the 3rd & 4th supplement, if it is higher than the average fees, that might stop some parents from cruising on those trips.. muffin > well at least that is the reasoning I would use if I was bringing kids.
Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions would be appreciated.
You wrote; <<Come in May instead of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves are coming out and the air is crisp.>> I wish WE could come earlier, but unfortunately, we only have August 10, 2002 as our one sailing option. It is absolutely impossible to change it. I realize you said the weather is nicer in May and early summer, but will early August be half-way decent, too, at least SOME of the days??:)
We have done the Anchorage to Vancouver trip in early August. The weather was mid to high 60’s and most days were sunny. It did rain in Ketchikan and that is almost a given to have rain there. We wore layers of clothing and had travel umbrella’s and didn’t miss a thing. Have a wonderful trip. —
This is no problem in Alaska as there are far fewer kids compared to the Caribbean. With your choice of the time I would think World Explorer would be a good option for very few kids. I do not recommend Sept travel. As the month goes on the bad weather factor multiplies many times over. Likely more rain, cold temps and dusk by 7pm, May is far better in my experience. As for Aug- it is my favorite time to travel Alaska- lower rates and still decent weather, great wildlife spotting. .>ead so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when >school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more >rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible >on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the >dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions >would be appreciated.
You can have iffy weather in May and September but it will reduce the number of kids onboard. Plus the longer cruisetour will not attract as many families – however there may be some on the cruise portion. Another option is try cruise on an upscale line – limited children’s programs. Late dinner used to mean less kids, but it’s not always the rule. Debbie Schroeder MCC Days Off Travel http://www.daysofftravel.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
>You can have iffy weather in May and September but it will reduce the number >of kids onboard. Plus the l
In my experience May is far better than September.
I’m coming in August, Roses. It’s the only month when my daughter and cabin mate can travel. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I live in Anchorage. Come in May instead > of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves > are coming out and the air is crisp. And you get here before everyone in > the tour industry is tuckered out and get grouchy !!! Alaska is the > vacation of a lifetime, please come on up.
I can personally say that on Crystal there were very few children. They even drop the Children’s Program person first if the ship get booked! We went at the end of June last year for 12 days and are doing the same time period this year slightly different cruise! Wayne
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska? Thank you,
> Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska?
Absolutly. — Charles
Good day, I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs southbound? 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or looking at the land? 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center or back? 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall? That’s all for now. Thank you, G. Robert
> I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
if you want to see the real alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship. the cruise lines will do their best to ensure that you *never* escape their clutches, and will steer you to stores and "attractions" that pay them kickbacks to do so. If you want to see the real Alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship! See the cruise industry rogue’s gallery at http://www.cruisejunkie.com/#Environmental_Issues
> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound?
South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but that’s a personal preference. > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land?
If you do the Inside Passage, there’s land on both sides of the ship. If the ship goes out to sea, you see no land except when very close to ports. > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back?
One way to experience the scenery of Alaska is within the cabin. I find it confining in the sense of space, perspective, viewing levels. Even with the emphasis with the current cruiser on balconies I say they are totally unnecessary to enjoy Alaska. I sailed in Alaska with no balcony. The open deck spaces are there and afford more in the way of choice. You can view whatever you like, change what side of the ship you are on, change the level of your viewing perspective providing the ship has open access to another level. With cabins, I think the important thing has to do with ship motion, lower and closer to center is best. Higher and more forward, the most motion is felt. If the ship has aft vibrations that may be notice aft and lower. There’s also the issue of how close the cabin is to stairways or perhaps under high traffic areas where you may hear noise overhead or in surrounding areas. > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Summer the weather is less extreme. I think spring tends to have more days that are misty. > That’s all for now.
Good questions. Ben S. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thank you, > G. Robert
> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Sounds more like a survey, than just you having questions…
I hope so, cuz that’s my next cruise, although not until July 31 of 2005. But, in the meantime, half the fun is in the planning and discussing. Welcome! Let’s talk Alaska! Lindsay – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska? >Thank you,
>> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but > that’s a personal preference.
When going north, how is Vancouver missing?
i like southbound. tour first, then more relaxing to cruise to vancouver. i love a balcony, although not necessary. southbound port side look at sea but also land only goes late spring, summer — Sheree
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall? > That’s all for now. > Thank you, > G. Robert
>>> Good day, >> I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: >> 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs >> southbound? > South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but > that’s a personal preference. >When going north, how is Vancouver missing?
It isn’t. You board in Vancouver. We went on the northbound trip in July. I’m glad we did it that way. The scenery became more and more spectacular as we went up the coast, so each day was better and better. We particularly liked ending with the view of Harvard Glacier. We also liked being on the right side of the ship. Yes, it is true that, on an Inside Passage cruise there is often land on both sides, the mainland is more likely to have mountains to view in the distance. Sheila
> if you want to see the real alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship. > the cruise lines will do their best to ensure that you *never* > escape their clutches, and will steer you to stores and > "attractions" that pay them kickbacks to do so.
Hey, Dennis – I hear that the old bitch that you called a "mother" finally died! Tell us, was it the arsenic in her mashed potatoes, or did you do the "antifreeze in the orange juice" trick? BTW, did you get the house?
I have cruised BOTH ways, the other posters may not have? I prefer southbound for the excellent last sailing day back to Vancouver alone Vancouver Island- good chance for orca sightings. This is done at night on the northbound. You need to look at and consider more than the route- strongly consider adding a week for interior touring- round trip Vancouver sailings and one ways are actually more similar than different- so TAKE ADVANAGE of being in Anchorage. I rarely consider any one ways without College Fjords and give a big edge to Seward over Whittier. BUT again- way too many people just pass though- don’t be one of them- again experience the excellent touring possibilities. A MAJOR mistake people make with interior touring planning is to underestimate time and distance- don’t get caught up in a short tour with all your time in transit. I am no fan of cruisetour and they are way overpriced for what little you get- extremely simple and far better to go on your own. Also look at time in ports, ports, and glacier. Budget fully for costly excursions- you get only half a trip without them.
As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much range in possible weather. If touring interior- strongly advised- have an arrival after June 1 for Denali Park roads to be open to at least Eielson.
Very interesting; we are thinking about the same kind of vacation in 2006, open jaw either to Fairbanks and back to Vancouver/Seattle or to Seattle/ Vancouver and out of Fairbanks, with one half being a cruise and the other a self-driven land vacation. We are just beginning planning. Why Seward over Whittier? Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these things on your own? Thanks in advance, Julie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have cruised BOTH ways, the other posters may not have? I prefer southbound > for the excellent last sailing day back to Vancouver alone Vancouver Island- > good chance for orca sightings. This is done at night on the northbound. You > need to look at and consider more than the route- strongly consider adding a > week for interior touring- round trip Vancouver sailings and one ways are > actually more similar than different- so TAKE ADVANAGE of being in Anchorage. > I rarely consider any one ways without College Fjords and give a big edge to > Seward over Whittier. BUT again- way too many people just pass though- don’t be > one of them- again experience the excellent touring possibilities. A MAJOR > mistake people make with interior touring planning is to underestimate time and > distance- don’t get caught up in a short tour with all your time in transit. > I am no fan of cruisetour and they are way overpriced for what little you get- > extremely simple and far better to go on your own. Also look at time in ports, > ports, and glacier. Budget fully for costly excursions- you get only half a > trip without them.
– Julie Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
>Why Seward over Whittier? >Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these >things on your own?
Seward offers just EXCELENT touring opportunities, Kenai Fjords boat trips are just superior for any varied marine wildlife viewing compared to other areas. But as I mentioned most people don’t have a clue and use this port to just pass though- don’t be one of them. :) As for why excursions are the most important???? The brochures are GREATLY enhanced- for wildlife viewing you NEED TOURS, superb are the flights which are my top recommendations. You need to consider FAR more than just getting off the ships in the ports and just walking around- you will see VERY little going this route. Necessary are plans and reservations in advances and certainly- plenty to arrange on your own. Myself- I NEVER consider any ship tours and alway go direct with venders, superior more personal tours, not always money savings. Request each city’s visitor guide- plenty of info. Head to your library and take out Frommer’s Alaska and Fodor’s Alaska- good concise books. There are NO Seattle one way cruises only Vancouver/ Whittier or Seward on the major lines. But easy transfer between Vancouver and Seattle. A MAJOR factor in your planning- do not underestimate time and distance in interior Alaska- too many people do. Don’t consider plans that are too time consuming on the travel. Best is to spend time in areas to see it. :0
Thanks so much for your input. We plan to preplan independant excursions in most areas. We’re headed via Seattle because we have friends there, I guess our plan is to take the train to Vancouver for a one way cruise (or back; still have not decided which. . . . ) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Why Seward over Whittier? >Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these >things on your own? > Seward offers just EXCELENT touring opportunities, Kenai Fjords boat trips are > just superior for any varied marine wildlife viewing compared to other areas. > But as I mentioned most people don’t have a clue and use this port to just pass > though- don’t be one of them. :) As for why excursions are the most > important???? The brochures are GREATLY enhanced- for wildlife viewing you > NEED TOURS, superb are the flights which are my top recommendations. You need > to consider FAR more than just getting off the ships in the ports and just > walking around- you will see VERY little going this route. Necessary are plans > and reservations in advances and certainly- plenty to arrange on your own. > Myself- I NEVER consider any ship tours and alway go direct with venders, > superior more personal tours, not always money savings. Request each city’s > visitor guide- plenty of info. Head to your library and take out Frommer’s > Alaska and Fodor’s Alaska- good concise books. There are NO Seattle one way > cruises only Vancouver/ Whittier or Seward on the major lines. But easy > transfer between Vancouver and Seattle. A MAJOR factor in your planning- do > not underestimate time and distance in interior Alaska- too many people do. > Don’t consider plans that are too time consuming on the travel. Best is to > spend time in areas to see it. :0
– Julie Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
>Good day, >I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: >1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs >southbound?
Southbound, Go up and sight see before the cruise, go see denali! then when you get on the cruise you can relax after the running around >2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or >looking at the land?
I had a Ocean side Balcony room on the summit in Sep. It was Great but I thing the Land side would have been better as you can only be "inspired" by ocean so long. One major plus though was the sunsets. >3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center >or back?
We wer all the way Aft and had a smooth ride >4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Been to alaska twice in the Fall and Loved both times though the weather can be rainy >That’s all for now. >Thank you, >G. Robert
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>As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much >range in possible weather.
I’m glad we hadn’t been given this advice the first time we cruised to Alaska. We departed sunny San Francisco the last week of September for a ten-day cruise. The only day of rain we had was in Ketchikan. We had a lot of sun most everywhere else. Would I prefer earlier? Sure. It’s warmer in Alaska earlier in the season. But if a great September deal came up, especially on a round-trip from San Francisco (which is at her best in September), I wouldn’t hesitate booking a round-trip cruise to Alaska after the first week of September.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much >range in possible weather. >I’m glad we hadn’t been given this advice the first time we cruised to >Alaska. >We departed sunny San Francisco the last week of September for a ten-day >cruise. The only day of rain we had was in Ketchikan. We had a lot of sun >most everywhere else. >Would I prefer earlier? Sure. It’s warmer in Alaska earlier in the season. >But if a great September deal came up, especially on a round-trip from San >Francisco (which is at her best in September), I wouldn’t hesitate booking a >round-trip cruise to Alaska after the first week of September.
Agree. I have also been very lucky in September too. Sure there were times there was more rain, but hey, I am from AZ and rain is a novelty. The only problem I have seen is getting up there before bearwatching season is over. But I lucked out on my September 19th cruise and had excellent flying weather in Ketchikan and saw many bears at Neets Bay! This happenned after being told it was too late in the season by many experts on this board and elsewhere. Next year I have planned a cruise on the Zaandam that departs September 10th. By going earlier in September, I hope to increase my chances to see the bears feeding on salmon (at Traitors Cove this time). The SF departure sounds wonderful and I would love to do it…..but I can’t get off that much work 
Sean
I am from Italy and i think to booking a 7 night cruise from Seattle to Alaska (roundtrip) in July 18, 2004. My preferred ship is Sapphire Princess and i find the best price at this internet travel agency: http://www.awcv.com/ It’s a good TA ? Someone of you had book a cruise with this TA ? Please write me your experience. Thanks in advance Frank
Be aware that this route has a lot of outside passage sailing compared to some Vancouver departures. The more inside the better in my experience. (my opinion only).
My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we would like to see as much as possible, as we have only 7 days to do it in.Thanks in advance for any help. Chad
If you only have 7 days, I strongly recommend a round trip. The travel time to or from Anchorage will consume many many more hours and dollars than the similar travel to or from Vancouver. Look for a cruise that includes Glacier Bay — it is the star attraction and not all cruises go there. KK – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. > I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, > a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we > would like to see as much as possible, as we have only 7 days to do it > in.Thanks in advance for any help. > Chad
I should have explained better I have 7 nights for the cruise itself , I can take a few extra days to travel to and from Detroit if I need it.Thanks in advance. Chad
>My wife and I are looking at taking a cruise in September of 2003 to Alaska. >I would like advice as to what type of cruise we should take, a North bound, >a South bound, or a round trip? This is going to be our first cruise and we >would like to see as muc
I would go the earliest possible in Sept as the bad weather factor multiplies as the month goes on. I wouldn’t consider a one way for my self without at least 5 additional interior touring days. It is such a long and expensive trip to get there that I want to make the most of it. If you do want a one way, I would go south- again for the weather factor. But don’t think round trips are shortchanging your self, they offer a lot in 7 days, 3 ports and a glacier same as the one ways. I also highly recommend Glacier Bay- my clear preference. More ships go into the Bay in Sept as they are outside the permit restrictions- at least I know that Carnival goes in???
Hi Chad, I too am doing my first Alaska cruise on Aug. 30 to Sept. 6th on Celebrity Infinity, its doing an inside passage. In case you want to check it out, here is the link: http://www.cruisemates.com/Articles/CMcruises/alaska2002.cfm I believe after this one, there will be 2 more Alaska cruises for this ship before heading south. Hope you find the right cruise for you. Donna Tuesday Chat Host http://www.cruisemates.com
My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! Teresa
Teresa, I’ve used Princess and did the 7 day tour and 7 day cruise. Alaska is incredible and if oyu can afford the time & money try to do the tour too. I picked Princess before I had cruised with them before and felt they gave good value for the money. You can go to their website 7 get info. Norma
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be >probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has >taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that >ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" >stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to >contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! >Teresa
Far more important than a specific line should be the route- ports, and glacier as most of what you should go to Alaska for is OUTSIDE the ship. :) I have cruised Alaska 9 times. I also DO NOT recommend a cruise tour. Very fixed schedule that glosses over the tourist areas. You can see more on your own for 1/2 the costs. None go far enough into Denali – I recommend at least to Eielson.
> I had the opposite experience with my 7-day Princess cruise earlier > this month. Princess botched pretty much everything under their > direct control; the shore excursions were generally OK, though (and > one was excellent). I would NOT recommend them. YMMV.
My experience on four Princess cruises is that they do not botch anything. They have been the best of all the lines doing things right, including the small details. I would recommend Princess over the other cruise lines.
> My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be > probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has > taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that > ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" > stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to > contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! > Teresa
We took a cruise from Vancouver to Seward on the Ryndam (Holland America Lines) this past June. The ship and service were first rate and we highly recommend this ship and HAL for those who like a quiet, subdued, and elegant atmosphere. As others have attested to in this newsgroup, HAL caters to the more sedate crowd, and if you’re looking for lots of nightlife, this might not be the line for you. We also took a four day land tour to Anchorage, Denali, and Fairbanks following the cruise, and although we enjoyed it very much, our opinion is that the Westours branch of HAL, which arranges and leads such tours, is not quite up to the excellent standards of effiency that we saw on the ship. For example, there were not enough busses waiting at the dock in Seward to accomodate all the people on our particular tour and some folks had to wait for an additional bus to arrive. On the other hand, the activities and sights were well worth it and we didn’t regret having signed up for the land tour as well as the cruise. Naomi
HOLLAND AMERICA has retractable pool cover – nice in Alaska climate.
> >HOLLAND AMERICA has retractable pool cover – nice in Alaska climate. > Indeed, it was VERY nice. The Westerdam has no balcony cabins, > though. I think, if we should ever go to Alaska on a cruise again, I > would like a balcony cabin.
Its the reason I didnt choose that ship for my Panama Cruise… despite the fact i liked its ports better… I went with the Maasdam… was very happy too ! jay Sun, Jul 22, 2001 > Karen > http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > (and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)
– Legend insists that as he finished his abject… Galileo muttered under his breath: "Nevertheless, it does move."
I’ve cruised Alaska 7 times and my advice would be to go on one of the adventure cruiselines like Clipper or Alaska Sightweeing. They have very small ships, have no onboard night life. they spend the nights in various ports and local entertainers come onboard. The cruises have no casinos, they are designed to really see Alaska. They carry historians and naturalists and in Alaska, Clipper brings a native totem carver onboard. An independent tour into either Denali or the Kenai Peninsula before or after the cruise would make it an ideal trip. The advantage of the small ship over the large one is the ability to go where the large ship can’t go and the ability to follow more wildlife. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My husband and I would like to take an Alaska cruise. This will be > probably mid 2002 or after. What I am looking for is anyone who has > taken an Alaska cruise…what ship did you take, why did you like that > ship/or not like it & would you recommend it. We are in the "looking" > stage and gathering information, so anything you would like to > contribute to our search would be gratefully appreciated! > Teresa > We took a cruise from Vancouver to Seward on the Ryndam (Holland > America Lines) this past June. The ship and service were first rate > and we highly recommend this ship and HAL for those who like a quiet, > subdued, and elegant atmosphere. As others have attested to in this > newsgroup, HAL caters to the more sedate crowd, and if you’re looking > for lots of nightlife, this might not be the line for you. > We also took a four day land tour to Anchorage, Denali, and Fairbanks > following the cruise, and although we enjoyed it very much, our > opinion is that the Westours branch of HAL, which arranges and leads > such tours, is not quite up to the excellent standards of effiency > that we saw on the ship. For example, there were not enough busses > waiting at the dock in Seward to accomodate all the people on our > particular tour and some folks had to wait for an additional bus to > arrive. > On the other hand, the activities and sights were well worth it and we > didn’t regret having signed up for the land tour as well as the > cruise. > Naomi
I have the Radiance booked for August of next year….but, unfortunately will need to postpone that trip…anyway, I hear the Radiance is a gorgeous ship and has LOTS of glass to view the beauty of Alaska. Besides that, she’s brand-spanking new!
I don’t like viewing through glass except in the dining room (fortunate to have a window table on the Rhapsody when that ship was "new"). Only a front open deck for me. :)
Princess does wonderful things in Alaska. There are several ships and itineraries to choose from. To read our reviews and see our pictures go to http://www.elite.net/~thehalls/cruising.html Mike
Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions would be appreciated.
>Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise >Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when >school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more >rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible >on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the >dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions >would be appreciated.
Weather is unpredictable; however, we sailed in Alaska in late-May one year and it was beautiful–more snow on the distant mountains and not terribly cold nor rainy. The only time during our cruise that I considered it "cold" was when we were viewing the glacier up close and spent most of the day outside on deck. Before we arrived at the glacier it was sunny and warm. The key is to dress in layers (add or subtract as necessary), have a cap to cover your ears, and at least light gloves. You won’t find any large cruise lines that outright bar children but you might want to look into some that don’t necessarily have very many on board. As a rule, they are the more upscale lines such as Crystal and Radisson. Seven Seas. Yes, later seating generally means fewer small children. Either that, or possibly some of the smaller soft expedition type ships like Cruise West. Hope this helps. —– Linda Coffman Cruise Diva http://cruisediva.com "The best islands in the world are the ones that float and move. They’re called cruise ships."
There are never as many kids on an Alaska cruise as there are on a Caribbean cruise. I remember sailing to Alaska on Princess when my daughter was a young teenager. She was the only kid onboard. The last time I sailed to Alaska was on Celebrity’s Galaxy and there were only 144 kids of all ages on the ship, a veery small percentage. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
I live in Anchorage. Come in May instead of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves are coming out and the air is crisp. And you get here before everyone in the tour industry is tuckered out and get grouchy !!! Alaska is the vacation of a lifetime, please come on up.
thank you for responding to my inquiry.
hiya! I think if you pick a trip longer than 7 days, you will have fewer kids onboard, (definitely do not pick less than 7 days) also if you check the pricing on the 3rd & 4th supplement, if it is higher than the average fees, that might stop some parents from cruising on those trips.. muffin > well at least that is the reasoning I would use if I was bringing kids.
Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions would be appreciated.
You wrote; <<Come in May instead of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves are coming out and the air is crisp.>> I wish WE could come earlier, but unfortunately, we only have August 10, 2002 as our one sailing option. It is absolutely impossible to change it. I realize you said the weather is nicer in May and early summer, but will early August be half-way decent, too, at least SOME of the days??:)
We have done the Anchorage to Vancouver trip in early August. The weather was mid to high 60’s and most days were sunny. It did rain in Ketchikan and that is almost a given to have rain there. We wore layers of clothing and had travel umbrella’s and didn’t miss a thing. Have a wonderful trip. —
This is no problem in Alaska as there are far fewer kids compared to the Caribbean. With your choice of the time I would think World Explorer would be a good option for very few kids. I do not recommend Sept travel. As the month goes on the bad weather factor multiplies many times over. Likely more rain, cold temps and dusk by 7pm, May is far better in my experience. As for Aug- it is my favorite time to travel Alaska- lower rates and still decent weather, great wildlife spotting. .>ead so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when >school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more >rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible >on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the >dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions >would be appreciated.
You can have iffy weather in May and September but it will reduce the number of kids onboard. Plus the longer cruisetour will not attract as many families – however there may be some on the cruise portion. Another option is try cruise on an upscale line – limited children’s programs. Late dinner used to mean less kids, but it’s not always the rule. Debbie Schroeder MCC Days Off Travel http://www.daysofftravel.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
>You can have iffy weather in May and September but it will reduce the number >of kids onboard. Plus the l
In my experience May is far better than September.
I’m coming in August, Roses. It’s the only month when my daughter and cabin mate can travel. Carole
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I live in Anchorage. Come in May instead > of Sept. It is sure to be rainy in Sept. May is a great month, leaves > are coming out and the air is crisp. And you get here before everyone in > the tour industry is tuckered out and get grouchy !!! Alaska is the > vacation of a lifetime, please come on up.
I can personally say that on Crystal there were very few children. They even drop the Children’s Program person first if the ship get booked! We went at the end of June last year for 12 days and are doing the same time period this year slightly different cruise! Wayne
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Read so many postings how to avoid cruises with kids. We want to cruise > Alaska for 10-12 days in 2002. If we are to avoid the months when > school is out, would May or September be very much cooler and more > rainy than the three summer months. We want as few kids as possible > on board. Also would a later dinner necessarily mean less kids in the > dinnig room? We are retired and never been on a cruise. Suggestions > would be appreciated.
Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska? Thank you,
> Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska?
Absolutly. — Charles
Good day, I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs southbound? 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or looking at the land? 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center or back? 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall? That’s all for now. Thank you, G. Robert
> I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
if you want to see the real alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship. the cruise lines will do their best to ensure that you *never* escape their clutches, and will steer you to stores and "attractions" that pay them kickbacks to do so. If you want to see the real Alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship! See the cruise industry rogue’s gallery at http://www.cruisejunkie.com/#Environmental_Issues
> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound?
South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but that’s a personal preference. > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land?
If you do the Inside Passage, there’s land on both sides of the ship. If the ship goes out to sea, you see no land except when very close to ports. > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back?
One way to experience the scenery of Alaska is within the cabin. I find it confining in the sense of space, perspective, viewing levels. Even with the emphasis with the current cruiser on balconies I say they are totally unnecessary to enjoy Alaska. I sailed in Alaska with no balcony. The open deck spaces are there and afford more in the way of choice. You can view whatever you like, change what side of the ship you are on, change the level of your viewing perspective providing the ship has open access to another level. With cabins, I think the important thing has to do with ship motion, lower and closer to center is best. Higher and more forward, the most motion is felt. If the ship has aft vibrations that may be notice aft and lower. There’s also the issue of how close the cabin is to stairways or perhaps under high traffic areas where you may hear noise overhead or in surrounding areas. > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Summer the weather is less extreme. I think spring tends to have more days that are misty. > That’s all for now.
Good questions. Ben S. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thank you, > G. Robert
> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Sounds more like a survey, than just you having questions…
I hope so, cuz that’s my next cruise, although not until July 31 of 2005. But, in the meantime, half the fun is in the planning and discussing. Welcome! Let’s talk Alaska! Lindsay – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Is this newsgroup appropriate to discuss cruises to Alaska? >Thank you,
>> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but > that’s a personal preference.
When going north, how is Vancouver missing?
i like southbound. tour first, then more relaxing to cruise to vancouver. i love a balcony, although not necessary. southbound port side look at sea but also land only goes late spring, summer — Sheree
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Good day, > I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: > 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs > southbound? > 2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or > looking at the land? > 3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center > or back? > 4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall? > That’s all for now. > Thank you, > G. Robert
>>> Good day, >> I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: >> 1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs >> southbound? > South will bring you more towards major cities like Vancouver, but > that’s a personal preference. >When going north, how is Vancouver missing?
It isn’t. You board in Vancouver. We went on the northbound trip in July. I’m glad we did it that way. The scenery became more and more spectacular as we went up the coast, so each day was better and better. We particularly liked ending with the view of Harvard Glacier. We also liked being on the right side of the ship. Yes, it is true that, on an Inside Passage cruise there is often land on both sides, the mainland is more likely to have mountains to view in the distance. Sheila
> if you want to see the real alaska, don’t come on a cruise ship. > the cruise lines will do their best to ensure that you *never* > escape their clutches, and will steer you to stores and > "attractions" that pay them kickbacks to do so.
Hey, Dennis – I hear that the old bitch that you called a "mother" finally died! Tell us, was it the arsenic in her mashed potatoes, or did you do the "antifreeze in the orange juice" trick? BTW, did you get the house?
I have cruised BOTH ways, the other posters may not have? I prefer southbound for the excellent last sailing day back to Vancouver alone Vancouver Island- good chance for orca sightings. This is done at night on the northbound. You need to look at and consider more than the route- strongly consider adding a week for interior touring- round trip Vancouver sailings and one ways are actually more similar than different- so TAKE ADVANAGE of being in Anchorage. I rarely consider any one ways without College Fjords and give a big edge to Seward over Whittier. BUT again- way too many people just pass though- don’t be one of them- again experience the excellent touring possibilities. A MAJOR mistake people make with interior touring planning is to underestimate time and distance- don’t get caught up in a short tour with all your time in transit. I am no fan of cruisetour and they are way overpriced for what little you get- extremely simple and far better to go on your own. Also look at time in ports, ports, and glacier. Budget fully for costly excursions- you get only half a trip without them.
As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much range in possible weather. If touring interior- strongly advised- have an arrival after June 1 for Denali Park roads to be open to at least Eielson.
Very interesting; we are thinking about the same kind of vacation in 2006, open jaw either to Fairbanks and back to Vancouver/Seattle or to Seattle/ Vancouver and out of Fairbanks, with one half being a cruise and the other a self-driven land vacation. We are just beginning planning. Why Seward over Whittier? Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these things on your own? Thanks in advance, Julie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have cruised BOTH ways, the other posters may not have? I prefer southbound > for the excellent last sailing day back to Vancouver alone Vancouver Island- > good chance for orca sightings. This is done at night on the northbound. You > need to look at and consider more than the route- strongly consider adding a > week for interior touring- round trip Vancouver sailings and one ways are > actually more similar than different- so TAKE ADVANAGE of being in Anchorage. > I rarely consider any one ways without College Fjords and give a big edge to > Seward over Whittier. BUT again- way too many people just pass though- don’t be > one of them- again experience the excellent touring possibilities. A MAJOR > mistake people make with interior touring planning is to underestimate time and > distance- don’t get caught up in a short tour with all your time in transit. > I am no fan of cruisetour and they are way overpriced for what little you get- > extremely simple and far better to go on your own. Also look at time in ports, > ports, and glacier. Budget fully for costly excursions- you get only half a > trip without them.
– Julie Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
>Why Seward over Whittier? >Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these >things on your own?
Seward offers just EXCELENT touring opportunities, Kenai Fjords boat trips are just superior for any varied marine wildlife viewing compared to other areas. But as I mentioned most people don’t have a clue and use this port to just pass though- don’t be one of them. :) As for why excursions are the most important???? The brochures are GREATLY enhanced- for wildlife viewing you NEED TOURS, superb are the flights which are my top recommendations. You need to consider FAR more than just getting off the ships in the ports and just walking around- you will see VERY little going this route. Necessary are plans and reservations in advances and certainly- plenty to arrange on your own. Myself- I NEVER consider any ship tours and alway go direct with venders, superior more personal tours, not always money savings. Request each city’s visitor guide- plenty of info. Head to your library and take out Frommer’s Alaska and Fodor’s Alaska- good concise books. There are NO Seattle one way cruises only Vancouver/ Whittier or Seward on the major lines. But easy transfer between Vancouver and Seattle. A MAJOR factor in your planning- do not underestimate time and distance in interior Alaska- too many people do. Don’t consider plans that are too time consuming on the travel. Best is to spend time in areas to see it. :0
Thanks so much for your input. We plan to preplan independant excursions in most areas. We’re headed via Seattle because we have friends there, I guess our plan is to take the train to Vancouver for a one way cruise (or back; still have not decided which. . . . ) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Why Seward over Whittier? >Why are the excursions so important. Is it difficult to arrange/do these >things on your own? > Seward offers just EXCELENT touring opportunities, Kenai Fjords boat trips are > just superior for any varied marine wildlife viewing compared to other areas. > But as I mentioned most people don’t have a clue and use this port to just pass > though- don’t be one of them. :) As for why excursions are the most > important???? The brochures are GREATLY enhanced- for wildlife viewing you > NEED TOURS, superb are the flights which are my top recommendations. You need > to consider FAR more than just getting off the ships in the ports and just > walking around- you will see VERY little going this route. Necessary are plans > and reservations in advances and certainly- plenty to arrange on your own. > Myself- I NEVER consider any ship tours and alway go direct with venders, > superior more personal tours, not always money savings. Request each city’s > visitor guide- plenty of info. Head to your library and take out Frommer’s > Alaska and Fodor’s Alaska- good concise books. There are NO Seattle one way > cruises only Vancouver/ Whittier or Seward on the major lines. But easy > transfer between Vancouver and Seattle. A MAJOR factor in your planning- do > not underestimate time and distance in interior Alaska- too many people do. > Don’t consider plans that are too time consuming on the travel. Best is to > spend time in areas to see it. :0
– Julie Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
>Good day, >I have a few questions concerning a cruise to Alaska: >1) Any preference in the directin of the cruise; i.e. northbound vs >southbound?
Southbound, Go up and sight see before the cruise, go see denali! then when you get on the cruise you can relax after the running around >2) Any preference in the location of the cabin? Looking at the sea or >looking at the land?
I had a Ocean side Balcony room on the summit in Sep. It was Great but I thing the Land side would have been better as you can only be "inspired" by ocean so long. One major plus though was the sunsets. >3) Position of the cabin on the boat: high, center or low and front, center >or back?
We wer all the way Aft and had a smooth ride >4) Best time of the year; spring, summer or fall?
Been to alaska twice in the Fall and Loved both times though the weather can be rainy >That’s all for now. >Thank you, >G. Robert
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>As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much >range in possible weather.
I’m glad we hadn’t been given this advice the first time we cruised to Alaska. We departed sunny San Francisco the last week of September for a ten-day cruise. The only day of rain we had was in Ketchikan. We had a lot of sun most everywhere else. Would I prefer earlier? Sure. It’s warmer in Alaska earlier in the season. But if a great September deal came up, especially on a round-trip from San Francisco (which is at her best in September), I wouldn’t hesitate booking a round-trip cruise to Alaska after the first week of September.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->As for time- don’t consider anything past the first week of Sept- too much >range in possible weather. >I’m glad we hadn’t been given this advice the first time we cruised to >Alaska. >We departed sunny San Francisco the last week of September for a ten-day >cruise. The only day of rain we had was in Ketchikan. We had a lot of sun >most everywhere else. >Would I prefer earlier? Sure. It’s warmer in Alaska earlier in the season. >But if a great September deal came up, especially on a round-trip from San >Francisco (which is at her best in September), I wouldn’t hesitate booking a >round-trip cruise to Alaska after the first week of September.
Agree. I have also been very lucky in September too. Sure there were times there was more rain, but hey, I am from AZ and rain is a novelty. The only problem I have seen is getting up there before bearwatching season is over. But I lucked out on my September 19th cruise and had excellent flying weather in Ketchikan and saw many bears at Neets Bay! This happenned after being told it was too late in the season by many experts on this board and elsewhere. Next year I have planned a cruise on the Zaandam that departs September 10th. By going earlier in September, I hope to increase my chances to see the bears feeding on salmon (at Traitors Cove this time). The SF departure sounds wonderful and I would love to do it…..but I can’t get off that much work Sean
Categories: Travel Italy | No Comments »
You should be fine if Delta enters Chapter 11 bankruptcy. Chapter 11 allows them to reorganize & keep operating while being protected from creditors. US Air has entered Chapter 11 twice in the last few years, and they are still flying. However, there are rumors that US Air may be forced into Chapter 7 bankruptcy. Chapter 7 is the one to worry about. Chapter 7 means the company will cease to exist. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >X-No-Archive: yes >There is rumour that Delta Airlines will go for Chapter 11 in a short time. >I am planning a journey from Europe to Chile, flying both ways with >Delta via Atlanta. The choice is between a IATA tariff ticket and a >(cheaper) consolidator ticket. >What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for >bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void? >Will a IATA tariff ticket be "honoured" by other IATA carriers? >Thanks for your input. >Carl Heinrich Apel >from Switzerland
First of all, I don’t believe that if Delta files for Chapter 11, they will cease flying. That being said, purchase your tickets from the airline, all else being comparable, and use a credit card. If Delta files for Chapter 11, they estimate they’ll still have $1.5 billion for operating capital, which should see them through the process. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> X-No-Archive: yes > There is rumour that Delta Airlines will go for Chapter 11 in a short time. > I am planning a journey from Europe to Chile, flying both ways with > Delta via Atlanta. The choice is between a IATA tariff ticket and a > (cheaper) consolidator ticket. > What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for > bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void? > Will a IATA tariff ticket be "honoured" by other IATA carriers? > Thanks for your input. > Carl Heinrich Apel > from Switzerland
> What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for > bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void?
Chapter 11 in the USA is designed to prevent a corporation from ceasing to exist. It protects a corporation from one creditor seizing assets when other creditors are willing to work things out. It also allows the corporation, through the judge that overseas the process, to void existing contracts without having to pay contract breakup fees. This allows the corporation to renegotiate aircraft leases, return aircraft to the lessors, and in the case of US airlines, especially renegotiate existing contracts with unionised employees. Delta is in no way shape or form any close to stopping operations. For what it is worth, United will have been in bankrupcy protection for 2 years and is still operating. To the passengers, the possible impacts are change in schedules (but ticketed passengers are protected on other flights), employee attitudes, and reduced quality of service.
> be forced into Chapter 7 bankruptcy. Chapter 7 is the one to worry > about. Chapter 7 means the company will cease to exist.
Shouldn’t the liquidation happen in a chapter that comes after chapter 11 ? Sounds like some story where the timeline goes backwards as you read through the book.
>What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for >bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void?
It is *very highly* unlikely that DL would cease all operations after an initial Chapter 11 filing. IMO, you have nothing whatsoever to worry about; at the very worst, DL could land up canceling some flights or routes and you’d be rescheduled onto another DL flight or perhaps another airline, just like if DL canceled flights for most any other reason. >Will a IATA tariff ticket be "honoured" by other IATA carriers?
I don’t think so (since there’d be no way for another airline to collect back on it, like they do when pax from one airline are accommodated on another airline, such as when UA put me on an AA flight once), but I may be wrong. Major airlines ceasing operations (not US domestic low-fare operations, which aside from stalwart WN seem to come and go a lot) are relatively rare… -SC — Stanley Cline — sc1 at roamer1 dot org — http://www.roamer1.org/ … "Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. There might be a law against it by that time." -/usr/games/fortune
>Eastern. >Pan Am. >TWA. >Braniff.
Eastern tickets were honored by Continental. Pan Am tickets were honored by Delta. TWA tickets were honored by American. Don’t remember what happened to Braniff, but I am pretty sure someone picked up their passengers. >Dump those US Air tickets if you can.
Chances are very good that some other airline will honor US Air tickets even even US Air ceases operations.
> >Eastern. >Pan Am. >TWA. >Braniff. > Eastern tickets were honored by Continental. Pan Am tickets were > honored by Delta. TWA tickets were honored by American. Don’t remember > what happened to Braniff, but I am pretty sure someone picked up > their passengers.
As someone stuck with Braniff tickets…. Other airlines will often "honor" the tickest on some stand by basis. Some will only credit the amount of the ticket towards a relatively full fare purchase on their airline (if it is "last minute"). But on or around the time that all the tickets turn to pumpkins, there are alot of folks looking to fill seats on those other airlines. One can "stand by" for a long time, especially if it was to a hub city of the dominatant carrier. >Dump those US Air tickets if you can. > Chances are very good that some other airline will honor US Air tickets > even even US Air ceases operations.
Hopefully one has purchased them with some sort of credit card and the card company will assume the loss. Amex did for me with the Braniff tickets. But even if Delta does go into some form of bankruptcy, they are a long way from folding. I’d hold the tickets unless I could get out for virtually no loss.
> As someone stuck with Braniff tickets…. > Other airlines will often "honor" the tickest on some stand by basis. >Some will only credit the amount of the ticket towards a relatively full >fare purchase on their airline (if it is "last minute").
I could have sworn that United and maybe Continental waived all advance-purchase restrictions for Braniff ticket holders.
> I could have sworn that United and maybe Continental waived all > advance-purchase restrictions for Braniff ticket holders.
This means that United would allow you to PURCHASE a low fare ticket beyond res/ticketing deadlines upon presentation of a dead airline’s ticket. Not quite the "we will honour your tickets at no cost to you".
>> I could have sworn that United and maybe Continental waived all > advance-purchase restrictions for Braniff ticket holders. >This means that United would allow you to PURCHASE a low fare ticket beyond >res/ticketing deadlines upon presentation of a dead airline’s ticket. Not >quite the "we will honour your tickets at no cost to you".
Indeed. But I also seem to remember that some airlines (America West?) honored Braniff tickets on a standby basis for a nominal fee. Eastern, Pan Am and TWA had their tickets honored, too. It’s a hassle to convert a bankrupt airline’s ticket into a ticket on another carrier, no question about it. But if past experience is any guide, it’s very unlikely that US Air tickets will turn into useless paper the moment US Air ceases operations.
> It’s a hassle to convert a bankrupt airline’s ticket into a ticket on > another carrier, no question about it. But if past experience is any > guide, it’s very unlikely that US Air tickets will turn into useless > paper the moment US Air ceases operations.
However, given the *risk* of US Air going belly up, say in November, you’d be much better off avoiding the potential hassles and booking and buying tickets on an airline whose risk of chapter 7 is next to nill. It isn’t just the hassles of converting a "dead" ticket, but also finding a seat on an aircraft which will be next to impossible, especially if you must travel on stand-by. Unless US Air provides substantially cheaper tickets, I would stay away from them for any long term travel plans (long terms being more than 2 months). But for short term travel (1 or 2 weeks), I woudln’t have problems flying on US Air.
> X-No-Archive: yes > There is rumour that Delta Airlines will go for Chapter 11 in a short time. > I am planning a journey from Europe to Chile, flying both ways with > Delta via Atlanta. The choice is between a IATA tariff ticket and a > (cheaper) consolidator ticket. > What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for > bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void?
Nothing. Chapter 11 is simply a re-organization of debt. Its Chapter 13 where a business goes belly up.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> X-No-Archive: yes > There is rumour that Delta Airlines will go for Chapter 11 in a short time. > I am planning a journey from Europe to Chile, flying both ways with > Delta via Atlanta. The choice is between a IATA tariff ticket and a > (cheaper) consolidator ticket. > What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for > bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void? > Nothing. Chapter 11 is simply a re-organization of debt. > Its Chapter 13 where a business goes belly up.
Check your "facts" before you post about something you don’t understand. Disinformation is worse than no information.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->X-No-Archive: yes >There is rumour that Delta Airlines will go for Chapter 11 in a short time. >I am planning a journey from Europe to Chile, flying both ways with >Delta via Atlanta. The choice is between a IATA tariff ticket and a >(cheaper) consolidator ticket. >What happens to these tickets if Delta grounds their fleet for >bancruptcy/Chapter 11? Will the tickets be void? > Nothing. Chapter 11 is simply a re-organization of debt. > Its Chapter 13 where a business goes belly up.
Chapter 13 is "ADJUSTMENT OF DEBTS OF AN INDIVIDUAL WITH REGULAR INCOME"
Categories: Italy Travel Guide | No Comments »
Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
By Taxi Taxis in Rome do not cruise, but if empty (look for an illuminated "taxi" sign on the roof) they will stop if you flag them down. Taxis wait at stands and can also be called by phone (06/5551, 06/3570, 06/4994, or 06/88177), in which case you’re charged a bit more. The meter starts at EUR2.33 from 7 AM to 10 PM, at EUR3.36 on Sunday and holidays, and at EUR4.91 after 10 PM. Each piece of baggage will add an extra EUR2.03 to your fare. Use only licensed, metered yellow or white cabs, identified by a numbered shield on the side, an illuminated taxi sign on the roof, and a plaque next to the license plate reading servizio pubblico. Avoid unmarked, unauthorized, unmetered gypsy cabs (numerous at airports and train stations), whose renegade drivers actively solicit your trade and may demand astronomical fares. Some taxis accept some credit cards, but you must specify when calling that you will pay that way. Taxi In Barcelona the taxis are yellow and black. A green light on top of the taxi indicates its availability. You can take a taxi from any of city’s numerous ranks and if you want to hail one in the street, just put out your hand when you see one approaching. Many taxis accept payment by credit card.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
>Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
I have no problem shopping my heart out online and giving my credit card number. Somehow giving my credit card number to a taxi driver just doesn’t sit well with me. ~ Patty "Life isn’t supposed to be easy, it’s supposed to be worth it"
>Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards? > I have no problem shopping my heart out online and giving my credit card > number. Somehow giving my credit card number to a taxi driver just doesn’t sit > well with me.
In some European countries it’s illegal to take a credit card out of the customer’s view. There also might be something in that law that disallows businesses from keeping copies of credit card numbers. So I’ve found most countries I’ve traveled in, including Italy and Spain, use these hand held scanners that employ cellular technology to send the card information to the credit card center and print out a receipt. The businesses don’t take the card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card number. Imagine Italians traveling in the US. What are they thinking the first time their waiter wanders off with their card or their taxi cab driver making a carbon copy of their credit card.
Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The businesses don’t take the > card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card > number.
> Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or may > not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for > reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
But in Europe they can only get this by running the card through to the card company. And I’m not sure they get to keep the whole card number. Credit card fraud is much less common in Europe because the laws favor the consumer’s privacy over businesses taking card numbers "just in case". – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The businesses don’t take the > card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card > number.
>Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or >may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for >reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
If I purchase something at Joe Schmoe’s with a credit card issued by someone other than Joe Schmoe, then the company which may retain my credit card number is that credit card issuing company, not Joe Schmoe. Joe Schmoe has already been paid by my credit card company and has no reason to keep my credit card number anywhere in his own database or drawer and in California, at least, only partial credit card numbers may be printed on receipts, including the receipt retained by Joe Schmoe. Hotels, cruise lines, etc. which are holding credit card numbers temporarily until final payment are no doubt handled differently, but if I buy shoes from Joe Schmoe (just one example), that transaction is over as soon as I have the shoes and he has received authorization that the credit card payment has been "made". If I go back to return the shoes, then I have to give my card back a second time for that credit to be issued. Joe Schmoe is not supposed to keep the credit card number "on file". In our case, we pay cash most of the time, and always at bookstores.
I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given day. They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his paperwork, they aren’t anywhere. Sure.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or >may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system >for >reconciliation and crediting if necessary. > If I purchase something at Joe Schmoe’s with a credit card issued by > someone > other than Joe Schmoe, then the company which may retain my credit card > number > is that credit card issuing company, not Joe Schmoe. > Joe Schmoe has already been paid by my credit card company and has no > reason > to keep my credit card number anywhere in his own database or drawer and > in > California, at least, only partial credit card numbers may be printed on > receipts, including the receipt retained by Joe Schmoe. > Hotels, cruise lines, etc. which are holding credit card numbers > temporarily > until final payment are no doubt handled differently, but if I buy shoes > from > Joe Schmoe (just one example), that transaction is over as soon as I have > the > shoes and he has received authorization that the credit card payment has > been > "made". > If I go back to return the shoes, then I have to give my card back a > second > time for that credit to be issued. Joe Schmoe is not supposed to keep the > credit card number "on file". > In our case, we pay cash most of the time, and always at bookstores.
> I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of > any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given day. > They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his paperwork, > they aren’t anywhere. > Sure.
They aren’t. Whatever is on the receipt is what the merchant has. That depends on the processing system. Most now only print the last four numbers. The merchants copy is the same as the customer copy. That is the merchants record. — Charles
No, that isn’t true. The merchant in many states has until July 1 2006 to truncate numbers on the credit card receipt they retain, but in most cases, the one the customer takes with them has to have the number truncated with no expiration date. While many people have gone to machines that are complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint before the July 2006 date, many have not. Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are not compliant? Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of > any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given > day. > They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his > paperwork, > they aren’t anywhere. > Sure. > They aren’t. Whatever is on the receipt is what the merchant has. That > depends on the processing system. Most now only print the last four > numbers. The merchants copy is the same as the customer copy. That is > the merchants record. > — > Charles
> While many people have gone to machines that are > complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint > before the July 2006 date, many have not. > Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are not > compliant? > Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do.
I think we are saying the same thing. The merchant has what is on the reciept. If the whole number is on there then the merchant has it. If it has only the last four numbers, which is what many merchants have now and all will have in the future, then the merchant will only have the last four numbers. — Charles
No we are not saying that. There are many machines out there that print out two different receipts. The one for the consumer without the full credit card number and without an expiration date, and their copy which has full information. There are four different ways this can happen. 1) The machine spits out a compliant receipt without full number or exp date on it on duplicate paper. You sign, keep the yellow, and the merchant has an exact copy. 2) The machine spits out a single compliant copy without number or exp on it, then another exact duplicate of that without number or exp on it for the merchant. 3) The machine spits out a single compliant copy for the customer without a full number or exp date on it. The machine then spits out a copy for the merchant with the full information on it. That is still legal in many states until 2006 4) The merchant doesn’t give a rats ass and never had his terminal programmed, so both copies have full card information on it. There are still lots of those out there too. Regardless of what the merchant does and does not get from his terminal, in many cases they also can get full card information in their settlement reports, either monthly or just by going online. Many of those have not yet been masked by the credit card merchant account providers. It’s fairly obvious that merchants retain account information, it’s been all over the news for years that hackers break in and steal them, not just from places that keep them to make your check out easier.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> While many people have gone to machines that are > complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint > before the July 2006 date, many have not. > Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are > not > compliant? > Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do. > I think we are saying the same thing. The merchant has what is on the > reciept. If the whole number is on there then the merchant has it. If > it has only the last four numbers, which is what many merchants have > now and all will have in the future, then the merchant will only have > the last four numbers. > — > Charles
> 2) The machine spits out a single compliant copy without number or exp on > it, then another exact duplicate of that without number or exp on it for the > merchant. > 3) The machine spits out a single compliant copy for the customer without a > full number or exp date on it. The machine then spits out a copy for the > merchant with the full information on it. That is still legal in many states > until 2006
Okay. The merchant whose record keeping I am familiar is doing number 2 now. Both receipts and their copy for electronic transactions. I agree that not all merchants in the US are currently doing number 2. — Charles
Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
By Taxi Taxis in Rome do not cruise, but if empty (look for an illuminated "taxi" sign on the roof) they will stop if you flag them down. Taxis wait at stands and can also be called by phone (06/5551, 06/3570, 06/4994, or 06/88177), in which case you’re charged a bit more. The meter starts at EUR2.33 from 7 AM to 10 PM, at EUR3.36 on Sunday and holidays, and at EUR4.91 after 10 PM. Each piece of baggage will add an extra EUR2.03 to your fare. Use only licensed, metered yellow or white cabs, identified by a numbered shield on the side, an illuminated taxi sign on the roof, and a plaque next to the license plate reading servizio pubblico. Avoid unmarked, unauthorized, unmetered gypsy cabs (numerous at airports and train stations), whose renegade drivers actively solicit your trade and may demand astronomical fares. Some taxis accept some credit cards, but you must specify when calling that you will pay that way. Taxi In Barcelona the taxis are yellow and black. A green light on top of the taxi indicates its availability. You can take a taxi from any of city’s numerous ranks and if you want to hail one in the street, just put out your hand when you see one approaching. Many taxis accept payment by credit card.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
>Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards?
I have no problem shopping my heart out online and giving my credit card number. Somehow giving my credit card number to a taxi driver just doesn’t sit well with me. ~ Patty "Life isn’t supposed to be easy, it’s supposed to be worth it"
>Do taxis in Rome or Barcelona accept credit cards? > I have no problem shopping my heart out online and giving my credit card > number. Somehow giving my credit card number to a taxi driver just doesn’t sit > well with me.
In some European countries it’s illegal to take a credit card out of the customer’s view. There also might be something in that law that disallows businesses from keeping copies of credit card numbers. So I’ve found most countries I’ve traveled in, including Italy and Spain, use these hand held scanners that employ cellular technology to send the card information to the credit card center and print out a receipt. The businesses don’t take the card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card number. Imagine Italians traveling in the US. What are they thinking the first time their waiter wanders off with their card or their taxi cab driver making a carbon copy of their credit card.
Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The businesses don’t take the > card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card > number.
> Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or may > not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for > reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
But in Europe they can only get this by running the card through to the card company. And I’m not sure they get to keep the whole card number. Credit card fraud is much less common in Europe because the laws favor the consumer’s privacy over businesses taking card numbers "just in case". – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The businesses don’t take the > card out of your view, nor do they get a copy of your full credit card > number.
>Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or >may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system for >reconciliation and crediting if necessary.
If I purchase something at Joe Schmoe’s with a credit card issued by someone other than Joe Schmoe, then the company which may retain my credit card number is that credit card issuing company, not Joe Schmoe. Joe Schmoe has already been paid by my credit card company and has no reason to keep my credit card number anywhere in his own database or drawer and in California, at least, only partial credit card numbers may be printed on receipts, including the receipt retained by Joe Schmoe. Hotels, cruise lines, etc. which are holding credit card numbers temporarily until final payment are no doubt handled differently, but if I buy shoes from Joe Schmoe (just one example), that transaction is over as soon as I have the shoes and he has received authorization that the credit card payment has been "made". If I go back to return the shoes, then I have to give my card back a second time for that credit to be issued. Joe Schmoe is not supposed to keep the credit card number "on file". In our case, we pay cash most of the time, and always at bookstores.
I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given day. They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his paperwork, they aren’t anywhere. Sure.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Businesses always have a full copy of the credit card number. It may or >may not print on the receipt, but they have a full copy in their system >for >reconciliation and crediting if necessary. > If I purchase something at Joe Schmoe’s with a credit card issued by > someone > other than Joe Schmoe, then the company which may retain my credit card > number > is that credit card issuing company, not Joe Schmoe. > Joe Schmoe has already been paid by my credit card company and has no > reason > to keep my credit card number anywhere in his own database or drawer and > in > California, at least, only partial credit card numbers may be printed on > receipts, including the receipt retained by Joe Schmoe. > Hotels, cruise lines, etc. which are holding credit card numbers > temporarily > until final payment are no doubt handled differently, but if I buy shoes > from > Joe Schmoe (just one example), that transaction is over as soon as I have > the > shoes and he has received authorization that the credit card payment has > been > "made". > If I go back to return the shoes, then I have to give my card back a > second > time for that credit to be issued. Joe Schmoe is not supposed to keep the > credit card number "on file". > In our case, we pay cash most of the time, and always at bookstores.
> I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of > any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given day. > They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his paperwork, > they aren’t anywhere. > Sure.
They aren’t. Whatever is on the receipt is what the merchant has. That depends on the processing system. Most now only print the last four numbers. The merchants copy is the same as the customer copy. That is the merchants record. — Charles
No, that isn’t true. The merchant in many states has until July 1 2006 to truncate numbers on the credit card receipt they retain, but in most cases, the one the customer takes with them has to have the number truncated with no expiration date. While many people have gone to machines that are complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint before the July 2006 date, many have not. Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are not compliant? Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I give up, everybody is right, the merchant has no record what so ever of > any of the credit card numbers processed through his store on any given > day. > They aren’t on his settlement reports, they aren’t on any of his > paperwork, > they aren’t anywhere. > Sure. > They aren’t. Whatever is on the receipt is what the merchant has. That > depends on the processing system. Most now only print the last four > numbers. The merchants copy is the same as the customer copy. That is > the merchants record. > — > Charles
> While many people have gone to machines that are > complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint > before the July 2006 date, many have not. > Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are not > compliant? > Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do.
I think we are saying the same thing. The merchant has what is on the reciept. If the whole number is on there then the merchant has it. If it has only the last four numbers, which is what many merchants have now and all will have in the future, then the merchant will only have the last four numbers. — Charles
No we are not saying that. There are many machines out there that print out two different receipts. The one for the consumer without the full credit card number and without an expiration date, and their copy which has full information. There are four different ways this can happen. 1) The machine spits out a compliant receipt without full number or exp date on it on duplicate paper. You sign, keep the yellow, and the merchant has an exact copy. 2) The machine spits out a single compliant copy without number or exp on it, then another exact duplicate of that without number or exp on it for the merchant. 3) The machine spits out a single compliant copy for the customer without a full number or exp date on it. The machine then spits out a copy for the merchant with the full information on it. That is still legal in many states until 2006 4) The merchant doesn’t give a rats ass and never had his terminal programmed, so both copies have full card information on it. There are still lots of those out there too. Regardless of what the merchant does and does not get from his terminal, in many cases they also can get full card information in their settlement reports, either monthly or just by going online. Many of those have not yet been masked by the credit card merchant account providers. It’s fairly obvious that merchants retain account information, it’s been all over the news for years that hackers break in and steal them, not just from places that keep them to make your check out easier.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> While many people have gone to machines that are > complaisant now, or are in states where it’s required they be complaint > before the July 2006 date, many have not. > Would you like a list of currently used credit card terminals that are > not > compliant? > Some merchants have full credit card numbers. I know I do. > I think we are saying the same thing. The merchant has what is on the > reciept. If the whole number is on there then the merchant has it. If > it has only the last four numbers, which is what many merchants have > now and all will have in the future, then the merchant will only have > the last four numbers. > — > Charles
> 2) The machine spits out a single compliant copy without number or exp on > it, then another exact duplicate of that without number or exp on it for the > merchant. > 3) The machine spits out a single compliant copy for the customer without a > full number or exp date on it. The machine then spits out a copy for the > merchant with the full information on it. That is still legal in many states > until 2006
Okay. The merchant whose record keeping I am familiar is doing number 2 now. Both receipts and their copy for electronic transactions. I agree that not all merchants in the US are currently doing number 2. — Charles
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