Question:

I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! -Mike H

Response:

The train station is something like 2 km or a little less from the port. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

Be careful of pickpockets at the train stations in Rome. –Tom

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The train station is something like 2 km or a little less from the > port. > Paul > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible > to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station > of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port > is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

I haven’t transfered from the airport to Roma Termini (the central train station), but would do it by the train link in a heartbeat–it’s efficient & inexpensive. In June, we did take the train from Roma Termini to Civitavecchia (actually, RT from Civ-Roma-Civ)…it was so easy. You can pull up the train schedules at http://www.trenitalia.com It’s about a 5 min. walk between the Civ train station and the entry into the port (exit the train station, walk down the hill to the main street running along the shore, begin walking to the right, or north, and you will come to the main artery into the port on your left). The day we were in port, Celebrity and Princess shared a shuttle bus stop at the mouth to the port where their pax could catch a free shuttle back to the ship. I assume the other lines do the same. The port at Civ is a large, commercial complex. The pier where the cruise ships are berthed is about 1 to 1-1/2 miles deep in the bowels of the port complex. So, if you can’t catch a shuttle to the ship, you will have to get a taxi.Of course, on arrival at Civ, you are not going to know where to meet the shuttle bus, if your cruise line offers one. So, you can either hope that you run into some fellow pax or cruise ship employees who will point you in the right direction, or you’ll just have to pay for the short taxi ride. I’m thinking others said it was 5E from the train station to the ship, but don’t hold me to that. Good luck! Have a great cruise. Diana Ball near Houston, TX

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

"Mike Howland" ha scritto nel messaggio: > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

  Hello Mike  The train from Rome to Civitavecchia is 40 minutes.  and you can take an Intercity train It’ s to simple!!! or a Train but this is 1 hours because it stops to all stations.  The station is 10 minutes on foot, you can see the ship on the train…. it’s not far.  Today i went to Civitavecchia by Intercity train from Rome it took 40 minutes….because it’s arrived 10 minutes later!!!    Good Bye, Alessia.

Response:

>Be careful of pickpockets at the train stations in Rome. >–Tom

Even more so, on the train… My husband caught a girl with her hand in his pocket.  He grabbed it, and she managed to shake loose, just as the train was making a stop. Of course, she ran out… She couldn’t have been more than 14 or 15.  DH, of course, had nothing in that pocket, as we had been forwarned of the problem… Pam

Response:

Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we buy them at Termini that morning? andrew. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I haven’t transfered from the airport to Roma Termini (the central train >station), but would do it by the train link in a heartbeat–it’s efficient & >inexpensive. In June, we did take the train from Roma Termini to >Civitavecchia (actually, RT from Civ-Roma-Civ)…it was so easy. You can >pull up the train schedules at http://www.trenitalia.com It’s about a 5 min. >walk between the Civ train station and the entry into the port (exit the >train station, walk down the hill to the main street running along the >shore, begin walking to the right, or north, and you will come to the main >artery into the port on your left). The day we were in port, Celebrity and >Princess shared a shuttle bus stop at the mouth to the port where their pax >could catch a free shuttle back to the ship. I assume the other lines do the >same. The port at Civ is a large, commercial complex. The pier where the >cruise ships are berthed is about 1 to 1-1/2 miles deep in the bowels of the >port complex. So, if you can’t catch a shuttle to the ship, you will have to >get a taxi.Of course, on arrival at Civ, you are not going to know where to >meet the shuttle bus, if your cruise line offers one. So, you can either >hope that you run into some fellow pax or cruise ship employees who will >point you in the right direction, or you’ll just have to pay for the short >taxi ride. I’m thinking others said it was 5E from the train station to the >ship, but don’t hold me to that. >Good luck! Have a great cruise. >Diana Ball >near Houston, TX > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Carnival Tropicale 1982 NCL Dawn 2004

Response:

Andrew, Short Answer: Buy your Roma-Civ tix at Termini that morning. Long Answer: I have thought about it, but haven’t come up with a reason to buy these commuter train tix in advance (which would be something of a hassle, fairly expensive vs. what you can already see is a cheap ticket, and would limit you to taking a particular train–you may need/desire the time flexibility of just showing up and taking the next train). Even if the trains are extraordinarily crowded for a holiday, I’d think an extra car might be added to the train or you’d surely just get on the next one? View this train like commuter trains in the US, e.g., the ones that take people in/out of NYC daily. You don’t usually reserve seats on such trains. They fill, and any overflow has to wait for the next one. I’m not sure what aspect of the Trenitalia site you found confusing. However, if it was just the class and pricing, don’t worry about either for this train ride. Those can be important factors if you are looking at training a distance, to Venice, say, but not for the milk run to Civ.  2nd class will be just fine, and the price will be nominal (the 7-9E data you retrieved sounds correct). The Trenitalia.com info that could be useful to you is the timetable of trains running from Termini to Civ. I often travel with a record of the train depature times & numbers covering the logical travel period. In your case, I’m thinking you’d better plan for a minimum of 2 hours from landing at FCO to catch a train from Termini (the Leonardo Express non-stop train takes about 40 min. from FCO to Roma Termini, but you need to allow for passport control, baggage claim, customs, then buying your ticket, catching the train, the train ride to Termini, & then buying your ticket and catching your train there). As you can see, trains leave frequently throughout the day from Termini to Civ, and that train ride is right at an hour, give or take. When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for "Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often. If you are going soon & no change has been made since we were there in June, the Roma-Civ train comes in/out all day long in the bin that is on the far right as you look out on all of the bins. You can buy train tickets (biglietti) from human ticket agents at windows or you can use ticket machines. (This applies at Termini and at FCO.) The machines will take credit cards and Euros. (You can get Euros from ATMS at FCO and at the train station.) You will need to possess a basic amount of knowledge of Italian words related to tickets, trains, number of pax, etc., to make it through the process of using the ticket machines, but it’s an intuitive process. You can do it! Saves time vs. waiting in queues…. (However, if you use a human ticket agent at FCO, you could likely go ahead and get your ticket for the Termini-Civ leg, and that would be a nice timesaver.) Anytime you use a train ticket in Italy, you need to validate your ticket before you get on the train. You do this by sticking the ticket into the orange machine that you will see as you approach the bin area. FYI, the trains have overhead compartments (not closed like on airplanes, but open, with railings) for luggage storage. Some train cars have luggage storage areas located near a door. I wouldn’t store my luggage away from me. Many people travel with luggage on these trains and put it overhead, at their feet, etc. You’ll manage (unless you are traveling with lots of pieces–in which case, you just need to forget the train and just get one of those private transfer services to take you to the ship!). Relative to security issues and to follow-up on the comments of some of the other posters, I don’t see the point of working people into an anxious state about pickpockets, making first time visitors think they are going to be accosted at every turn? We’ve been to Rome several times, used all forms of public transportation, our feet and scooters to cover the city from head to toe, day and night, and not once witnessed any suspicious behavior or felt threatened in any way. IMO, you can be the victim of a theft crime anywhere, including in the US, if you don’t use common sense about your personal safety. It’s not difficult to make a few adjustments that will take you out of the "easy target" category. Read and heed the lists of usual precautions. Hope this makes things more clear? Have a great time! Diana

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I > just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a > 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. > Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we > buy them at Termini that morning? > andrew.

Response:

Oh, Andrew, I appreciate your kind remarks, but you’ll be laughing over the fuss when you get back. Once you do this, you’ll have it down, too! I guess it was the OP who was flying into Rome, sorry for the confusion. The same general info I described will apply to your Venice-Roma ride. Because that is a longer trip, not a commuter hop like Roma-Civitavecchia, yes, you might want to travel in 1st class as was more thoroughly discussed by Karen. However, I agree with her opinion that 2nd class trains in Italy are quite comfortable and will suffice for most day trips of reasonable duration. Note, if you have a smoking preference, when you walk alongside your train as it sits in its "bin," it will consist of a string of passenger cars, some which will bear a "smoking" icon, others which will bear a "no smoking" icon. Select a car accordingly, but if you are non-smokers, be forewarned that the locals don’t always follow the "no smoking" rules. You may have to move. The cars communicate, so you can change cars during travel, walk to the dining or snack bar car, etc. FYI, all major train stations will feature a variety of retail stores, fast food, an Internet stop, etc. Check out the 9 Euro BIRG ticket good for 24-hour unlimited use of the trains (except express), subways and buses in and around Rome. Depending on your plans for your final day in Rome/transfer out to Civ, this ticket might be an economical choice for that day. It will definitely cover the ride to Civ (we used the 9E for our round trip Civ-Roma-Civ plus subways in the city). You’ve planned a very nice pre-cruise land trip in Italy. Enjoy! And yes, I think doing The Amazing Race would be a blast, don’t you?! Diana

Response:

Gosh Diana you’re better than Rick Steves! I’ve copied and pasted your instructions to my travel file. We’ll actually be training in from Venice and staying a few days in Rome before our cruise. Your details have made me that much more relaxed about getting to the ship. If they ever accept my application for The Amazing Race, I’m counting on you being my partner! thanks again, andrew. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Andrew, >Short Answer: Buy your Roma-Civ tix at Termini that morning. >Long Answer: I have thought about it, but haven’t come up with a reason to >buy these commuter train tix in advance (which would be something of a >hassle, fairly expensive vs. what you can already see is a cheap ticket, and >would limit you to taking a particular train–you may need/desire the time >flexibility of just showing up and taking the next train). Even if the >trains are extraordinarily crowded for a holiday, I’d think an extra car >might be added to the train or you’d surely just get on the next one? View >this train like commuter trains in the US, e.g., the ones that take people >in/out of NYC daily. You don’t usually reserve seats on such trains. They >fill, and any overflow has to wait for the next one. >I’m not sure what aspect of the Trenitalia site you found confusing. >However, if it was just the class and pricing, don’t worry about either for >this train ride. Those can be important factors if you are looking at >training a distance, to Venice, say, but not for the milk run to Civ.  2nd >class will be just fine, and the price will be nominal (the 7-9E data you >retrieved sounds correct). The Trenitalia.com info that could be useful to >you is the timetable of trains running from Termini to Civ. I often travel >with a record of the train depature times & numbers covering the logical >travel period. In your case, I’m thinking you’d better plan for a minimum of >2 hours from landing at FCO to catch a train from Termini (the Leonardo >Express non-stop train takes about 40 min. from FCO to Roma Termini, but you >need to allow for passport control, baggage claim, customs, then buying your >ticket, catching the train, the train ride to Termini, & then buying your >ticket and catching your train there). As you can see, trains leave >frequently throughout the day from Termini to Civ, and that train ride is >right at an hour, give or take. >When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures >Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for >"Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that >numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often. If >you are going soon & no change has been made since we were there in June, >the Roma-Civ train comes in/out all day long in the bin that is on the far >right as you look out on all of the bins. >You can buy train tickets (biglietti) from human ticket agents at windows or >you can use ticket machines. (This applies at Termini and at FCO.) The >machines will take credit cards and Euros. (You can get Euros from ATMS at >FCO and at the train station.) You will need to possess a basic amount of >knowledge of Italian words related to tickets, trains, number of pax, etc., >to make it through the process of using the ticket machines, but it’s an >intuitive process. You can do it! Saves time vs. waiting in queues…. >(However, if you use a human ticket agent at FCO, you could likely go ahead >and get your ticket for the Termini-Civ leg, and that would be a nice >timesaver.) >Anytime you use a train ticket in Italy, you need to validate your ticket >before you get on the train. You do this by sticking the ticket into the >orange machine that you will see as you approach the bin area. >FYI, the trains have overhead compartments (not closed like on airplanes, >but open, with railings) for luggage storage. Some train cars have luggage >storage areas located near a door. I wouldn’t store my luggage away from me. >Many people travel with luggage on these trains and put it overhead, at >their feet, etc. You’ll manage (unless you are traveling with lots of >pieces–in which case, you just need to forget the train and just get one of >those private transfer services to take you to the ship!). >Relative to security issues and to follow-up on the comments of some of the >other posters, I don’t see the point of working people into an anxious state >about pickpockets, making first time visitors think they are going to be >accosted at every turn? We’ve been to Rome several times, used all forms of >public transportation, our feet and scooters to cover the city from head to >toe, day and night, and not once witnessed any suspicious behavior or felt >threatened in any way. IMO, you can be the victim of a theft crime anywhere, >including in the US, if you don’t use common sense about your personal >safety. It’s not difficult to make a few adjustments that will take you out >of the "easy target" category. Read and heed the lists of usual precautions. >Hope this makes things more clear? Have a great time! >Diana > Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I > just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a > 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. > Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we > buy them at Termini that morning? > andrew.

Carnival Tropicale 1982 NCL Dawn 2004

Response:

> When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures > Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for > "Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that > numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often.

<Additional good, practical advice snipped.> You will also encounter diagrams that are *suppose* to show the location of the first and second class cars, a useful piece of information if you want to know where to stand in antipcation of the train’s arrival. However, the reality is far from the promise of the diagram. My husband and I buy first-class tickets, especially when traveling with luggage, and we continue to consult the diagram. However, we have long since stopped insisting on riding in our first-class seats if the train is not arranged the way it is supposed to be and our seats are not located conveniently to where we board the train. Italian second-class train compartments are really quite comfortable, and we find it easier to find seats with reasonable luggage storage *anywhere* than to struggle against people in crowded train aisles or on the platform locating the first-class cars. Karen Selwyn

Response:

I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! -Mike H

Response:

The train station is something like 2 km or a little less from the port. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

Be careful of pickpockets at the train stations in Rome. –Tom

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The train station is something like 2 km or a little less from the > port. > Paul > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible > to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station > of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port > is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

I haven’t transfered from the airport to Roma Termini (the central train station), but would do it by the train link in a heartbeat–it’s efficient & inexpensive. In June, we did take the train from Roma Termini to Civitavecchia (actually, RT from Civ-Roma-Civ)…it was so easy. You can pull up the train schedules at http://www.trenitalia.com It’s about a 5 min. walk between the Civ train station and the entry into the port (exit the train station, walk down the hill to the main street running along the shore, begin walking to the right, or north, and you will come to the main artery into the port on your left). The day we were in port, Celebrity and Princess shared a shuttle bus stop at the mouth to the port where their pax could catch a free shuttle back to the ship. I assume the other lines do the same. The port at Civ is a large, commercial complex. The pier where the cruise ships are berthed is about 1 to 1-1/2 miles deep in the bowels of the port complex. So, if you can’t catch a shuttle to the ship, you will have to get a taxi.Of course, on arrival at Civ, you are not going to know where to meet the shuttle bus, if your cruise line offers one. So, you can either hope that you run into some fellow pax or cruise ship employees who will point you in the right direction, or you’ll just have to pay for the short taxi ride. I’m thinking others said it was 5E from the train station to the ship, but don’t hold me to that. Good luck! Have a great cruise. Diana Ball near Houston, TX

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Response:

"Mike Howland" ha scritto nel messaggio: > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

  Hello Mike  The train from Rome to Civitavecchia is 40 minutes.  and you can take an Intercity train It’ s to simple!!! or a Train but this is 1 hours because it stops to all stations.  The station is 10 minutes on foot, you can see the ship on the train…. it’s not far.  Today i went to Civitavecchia by Intercity train from Rome it took 40 minutes….because it’s arrived 10 minutes later!!!    Good Bye, Alessia.

Response:

>Be careful of pickpockets at the train stations in Rome. >–Tom

Even more so, on the train… My husband caught a girl with her hand in his pocket.  He grabbed it, and she managed to shake loose, just as the train was making a stop. Of course, she ran out… She couldn’t have been more than 14 or 15.  DH, of course, had nothing in that pocket, as we had been forwarned of the problem… Pam

Response:

Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we buy them at Termini that morning? andrew. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I haven’t transfered from the airport to Roma Termini (the central train >station), but would do it by the train link in a heartbeat–it’s efficient & >inexpensive. In June, we did take the train from Roma Termini to >Civitavecchia (actually, RT from Civ-Roma-Civ)…it was so easy. You can >pull up the train schedules at http://www.trenitalia.com It’s about a 5 min. >walk between the Civ train station and the entry into the port (exit the >train station, walk down the hill to the main street running along the >shore, begin walking to the right, or north, and you will come to the main >artery into the port on your left). The day we were in port, Celebrity and >Princess shared a shuttle bus stop at the mouth to the port where their pax >could catch a free shuttle back to the ship. I assume the other lines do the >same. The port at Civ is a large, commercial complex. The pier where the >cruise ships are berthed is about 1 to 1-1/2 miles deep in the bowels of the >port complex. So, if you can’t catch a shuttle to the ship, you will have to >get a taxi.Of course, on arrival at Civ, you are not going to know where to >meet the shuttle bus, if your cruise line offers one. So, you can either >hope that you run into some fellow pax or cruise ship employees who will >point you in the right direction, or you’ll just have to pay for the short >taxi ride. I’m thinking others said it was 5E from the train station to the >ship, but don’t hold me to that. >Good luck! Have a great cruise. >Diana Ball >near Houston, TX > I see the cruise transfers and things like that but is it possible to take > the train?  I know you have to go into Rome and then to the station of > Civitatecchia but has anyone done this?  How far away from the port is the > train station?  Thanks for your advice and directions! > -Mike H

Carnival Tropicale 1982 NCL Dawn 2004

Response:

Andrew, Short Answer: Buy your Roma-Civ tix at Termini that morning. Long Answer: I have thought about it, but haven’t come up with a reason to buy these commuter train tix in advance (which would be something of a hassle, fairly expensive vs. what you can already see is a cheap ticket, and would limit you to taking a particular train–you may need/desire the time flexibility of just showing up and taking the next train). Even if the trains are extraordinarily crowded for a holiday, I’d think an extra car might be added to the train or you’d surely just get on the next one? View this train like commuter trains in the US, e.g., the ones that take people in/out of NYC daily. You don’t usually reserve seats on such trains. They fill, and any overflow has to wait for the next one. I’m not sure what aspect of the Trenitalia site you found confusing. However, if it was just the class and pricing, don’t worry about either for this train ride. Those can be important factors if you are looking at training a distance, to Venice, say, but not for the milk run to Civ.  2nd class will be just fine, and the price will be nominal (the 7-9E data you retrieved sounds correct). The Trenitalia.com info that could be useful to you is the timetable of trains running from Termini to Civ. I often travel with a record of the train depature times & numbers covering the logical travel period. In your case, I’m thinking you’d better plan for a minimum of 2 hours from landing at FCO to catch a train from Termini (the Leonardo Express non-stop train takes about 40 min. from FCO to Roma Termini, but you need to allow for passport control, baggage claim, customs, then buying your ticket, catching the train, the train ride to Termini, & then buying your ticket and catching your train there). As you can see, trains leave frequently throughout the day from Termini to Civ, and that train ride is right at an hour, give or take. When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for "Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often. If you are going soon & no change has been made since we were there in June, the Roma-Civ train comes in/out all day long in the bin that is on the far right as you look out on all of the bins. You can buy train tickets (biglietti) from human ticket agents at windows or you can use ticket machines. (This applies at Termini and at FCO.) The machines will take credit cards and Euros. (You can get Euros from ATMS at FCO and at the train station.) You will need to possess a basic amount of knowledge of Italian words related to tickets, trains, number of pax, etc., to make it through the process of using the ticket machines, but it’s an intuitive process. You can do it! Saves time vs. waiting in queues…. (However, if you use a human ticket agent at FCO, you could likely go ahead and get your ticket for the Termini-Civ leg, and that would be a nice timesaver.) Anytime you use a train ticket in Italy, you need to validate your ticket before you get on the train. You do this by sticking the ticket into the orange machine that you will see as you approach the bin area. FYI, the trains have overhead compartments (not closed like on airplanes, but open, with railings) for luggage storage. Some train cars have luggage storage areas located near a door. I wouldn’t store my luggage away from me. Many people travel with luggage on these trains and put it overhead, at their feet, etc. You’ll manage (unless you are traveling with lots of pieces–in which case, you just need to forget the train and just get one of those private transfer services to take you to the ship!). Relative to security issues and to follow-up on the comments of some of the other posters, I don’t see the point of working people into an anxious state about pickpockets, making first time visitors think they are going to be accosted at every turn? We’ve been to Rome several times, used all forms of public transportation, our feet and scooters to cover the city from head to toe, day and night, and not once witnessed any suspicious behavior or felt threatened in any way. IMO, you can be the victim of a theft crime anywhere, including in the US, if you don’t use common sense about your personal safety. It’s not difficult to make a few adjustments that will take you out of the "easy target" category. Read and heed the lists of usual precautions. Hope this makes things more clear? Have a great time! Diana

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I > just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a > 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. > Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we > buy them at Termini that morning? > andrew.

Response:

> When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures > Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for > "Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that > numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often.

<Additional good, practical advice snipped.> You will also encounter diagrams that are *suppose* to show the location of the first and second class cars, a useful piece of information if you want to know where to stand in antipcation of the train’s arrival. However, the reality is far from the promise of the diagram. My husband and I buy first-class tickets, especially when traveling with luggage, and we continue to consult the diagram. However, we have long since stopped insisting on riding in our first-class seats if the train is not arranged the way it is supposed to be and our seats are not located conveniently to where we board the train. Italian second-class train compartments are really quite comfortable, and we find it easier to find seats with reasonable luggage storage *anywhere* than to struggle against people in crowded train aisles or on the platform locating the first-class cars. Karen Selwyn

Response:

Gosh Diana you’re better than Rick Steves! I’ve copied and pasted your instructions to my travel file. We’ll actually be training in from Venice and staying a few days in Rome before our cruise. Your details have made me that much more relaxed about getting to the ship. If they ever accept my application for The Amazing Race, I’m counting on you being my partner! thanks again, andrew. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Andrew, >Short Answer: Buy your Roma-Civ tix at Termini that morning. >Long Answer: I have thought about it, but haven’t come up with a reason to >buy these commuter train tix in advance (which would be something of a >hassle, fairly expensive vs. what you can already see is a cheap ticket, and >would limit you to taking a particular train–you may need/desire the time >flexibility of just showing up and taking the next train). Even if the >trains are extraordinarily crowded for a holiday, I’d think an extra car >might be added to the train or you’d surely just get on the next one? View >this train like commuter trains in the US, e.g., the ones that take people >in/out of NYC daily. You don’t usually reserve seats on such trains. They >fill, and any overflow has to wait for the next one. >I’m not sure what aspect of the Trenitalia site you found confusing. >However, if it was just the class and pricing, don’t worry about either for >this train ride. Those can be important factors if you are looking at >training a distance, to Venice, say, but not for the milk run to Civ.  2nd >class will be just fine, and the price will be nominal (the 7-9E data you >retrieved sounds correct). The Trenitalia.com info that could be useful to >you is the timetable of trains running from Termini to Civ. I often travel >with a record of the train depature times & numbers covering the logical >travel period. In your case, I’m thinking you’d better plan for a minimum of >2 hours from landing at FCO to catch a train from Termini (the Leonardo >Express non-stop train takes about 40 min. from FCO to Roma Termini, but you >need to allow for passport control, baggage claim, customs, then buying your >ticket, catching the train, the train ride to Termini, & then buying your >ticket and catching your train there). As you can see, trains leave >frequently throughout the day from Termini to Civ, and that train ride is >right at an hour, give or take. >When you arrive at the Termini station, you will need to find a Departures >Board, look for the train to Civ and see what numbered "Bin" (short for >"Binario" = platform) the Roma-Civ train is using. You will walk to that >numbered platform. I don’t think they change the platforms very often. If >you are going soon & no change has been made since we were there in June, >the Roma-Civ train comes in/out all day long in the bin that is on the far >right as you look out on all of the bins. >You can buy train tickets (biglietti) from human ticket agents at windows or >you can use ticket machines. (This applies at Termini and at FCO.) The >machines will take credit cards and Euros. (You can get Euros from ATMS at >FCO and at the train station.) You will need to possess a basic amount of >knowledge of Italian words related to tickets, trains, number of pax, etc., >to make it through the process of using the ticket machines, but it’s an >intuitive process. You can do it! Saves time vs. waiting in queues…. >(However, if you use a human ticket agent at FCO, you could likely go ahead >and get your ticket for the Termini-Civ leg, and that would be a nice >timesaver.) >Anytime you use a train ticket in Italy, you need to validate your ticket >before you get on the train. You do this by sticking the ticket into the >orange machine that you will see as you approach the bin area. >FYI, the trains have overhead compartments (not closed like on airplanes, >but open, with railings) for luggage storage. Some train cars have luggage >storage areas located near a door. I wouldn’t store my luggage away from me. >Many people travel with luggage on these trains and put it overhead, at >their feet, etc. You’ll manage (unless you are traveling with lots of >pieces–in which case, you just need to forget the train and just get one of >those private transfer services to take you to the ship!). >Relative to security issues and to follow-up on the comments of some of the >other posters, I don’t see the point of working people into an anxious state >about pickpockets, making first time visitors think they are going to be >accosted at every turn? We’ve been to Rome several times, used all forms of >public transportation, our feet and scooters to cover the city from head to >toe, day and night, and not once witnessed any suspicious behavior or felt >threatened in any way. IMO, you can be the victim of a theft crime anywhere, >including in the US, if you don’t use common sense about your personal >safety. It’s not difficult to make a few adjustments that will take you out >of the "easy target" category. Read and heed the lists of usual precautions. >Hope this makes things more clear? Have a great time! >Diana > Thanks Diana. This is great information for our upcoming cruise. I > just checked the very confusing trenitalia site and it looks like a > 7 Euro trip from Termini to Civ via 2nd class..9 Euro trip 1st class. > Would you suggest we buy these tickets ahead of time or can we > buy them at Termini that morning? > andrew.

Carnival Tropicale 1982 NCL Dawn 2004

Response:

Oh, Andrew, I appreciate your kind remarks, but you’ll be laughing over the fuss when you get back. Once you do this, you’ll have it down, too! I guess it was the OP who was flying into Rome, sorry for the confusion. The same general info I described will apply to your Venice-Roma ride. Because that is a longer trip, not a commuter hop like Roma-Civitavecchia, yes, you might want to travel in 1st class as was more thoroughly discussed by Karen. However, I agree with her opinion that 2nd class trains in Italy are quite comfortable and will suffice for most day trips of reasonable duration. Note, if you have a smoking preference, when you walk alongside your train as it sits in its "bin," it will consist of a string of passenger cars, some which will bear a "smoking" icon, others which will bear a "no smoking" icon. Select a car accordingly, but if you are non-smokers, be forewarned that the locals don’t always follow the "no smoking" rules. You may have to move. The cars communicate, so you can change cars during travel, walk to the dining or snack bar car, etc. FYI, all major train stations will feature a variety of retail stores, fast food, an Internet stop, etc. Check out the 9 Euro BIRG ticket good for 24-hour unlimited use of the trains (except express), subways and buses in and around Rome. Depending on your plans for your final day in Rome/transfer out to Civ, this ticket might be an economical choice for that day. It will definitely cover the ride to Civ (we used the 9E for our round trip Civ-Roma-Civ plus subways in the city). You’ve planned a very nice pre-cruise land trip in Italy. Enjoy! And yes, I think doing The Amazing Race would be a blast, don’t you?! Diana

Response:

Question:

Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you let them know.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >We don’t do credit cards, only debit > Hi Les, > You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily > limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if > the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or > any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of. > Thanx Ray. I’ve actually already informed my bank that I have the large > balance on. It’s actually the same card I used to pay for the cruise and > airline tickets. So there was no need to tell them, but I wanted to be safe. > LES!

Response:

>Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks >will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow >the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from >overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying >you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you >let them know.

Better tell them b/c even when you do, they freeze those buggers.

Response:

> Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you > let them know.

Mike, Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a hotel in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. –Jean

Response:

Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted virtually noplace outside of the United States. It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any other charges until they called Visa.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > verifying > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you > let them know. > Mike, > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a hotel > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > –Jean

Response:

The only problem with that, Mike, is if they put a hold on the card WHILE you are traveling and there is therefore no way to reach you. I do recall that a friend had her American Express Platinum card stopped while she was traveling with us through Alaska.  Fortunately she had a business and when AMEX called her secretary advised them that she was on vacation and that the charges were hers. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted virtually > noplace outside of the United States. > It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any other > charges until they called Visa. > > Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t > follow > > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in > from > > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > verifying > > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good > you > > let them know. > Mike, > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a > hotel > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > –Jean

Response:

When the card is refused, you call them.  That’s way faster then them calling you.  they can usually take off the hold while you are on the call and they can swipe your card again.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The only problem with that, Mike, is if they put a hold on the card WHILE > you are traveling and there is therefore no way to reach you. > I do recall that a friend had her American Express Platinum card stopped > while she was traveling with us through Alaska.  Fortunately she had a > business and when AMEX called her secretary advised them that she was on > vacation and that the charges were hers. > — > DG in Cherry Hill, NJ > Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted > virtually > noplace outside of the United States. > It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any > other > charges until they called Visa. > > > Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many > banks > > > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t > follow > > > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in > from > > > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > > verifying > > > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good > you > > > let them know. > > Mike, > > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa > called > > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a > hotel > > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > > –Jean

Response:

>We don’t do credit cards, only debit > Hi Les, > You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily > limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if > the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or > any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of.

Thanx Ray. I’ve actually already informed my bank that I have the large balance on. It’s actually the same card I used to pay for the cruise and airline tickets. So there was no need to tell them, but I wanted to be safe. LES!

Response:

>We don’t do credit cards, only debit

Hi Les, You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of. Best regards, Ray LIGHTHOUSE TRAVEL 800-719-9917 or 805-566-3905 http://www.lighthousetravel.com

Response:

Try to carry a credit card that does NOT charge a premium for currency conversion.  Either read the fine print on your agreement or call your card company and ask them. The charge for purchases in non US$ currency can be from 0 to 2%.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our > cruise budget. > Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should > we carry? > How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending > money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we > still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was > thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided > up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be > better to have more cash than cards? > Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting > ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that > has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, > so that’s a completely separate budget. > Anyway, what would you all suggest? > LES! > Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes > Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our cruise budget. Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should we carry? How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be better to have more cash than cards? Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, so that’s a completely separate budget. Anyway, what would you all suggest? LES! Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

Where are you cruising?  If it’s someplace that dollars are accepted, then $100 or $200 to start is fine, but if it’s someplace that dollars are not normally accepted, then you would want less cash and withdraw from an ATM in port to get local currency. Remember, each time you change dollars for local money, you will pay a hefty conversion fee.  It’s probably better to take it out in a local ATM in port unless you have a bank that charges a fortune for out of country transactions. Also, make sure you have a 4 digit PIN and you know it as numbers, not just letters, as many machines out of the US don’t have letters on the keys.  If your bank is still using a 6 digit PIN, just go in and ask they convert you to a 4. Don’t go too nuts with the small bills.  The purser’s desk can change big bills for you.  You don’t want it to look like you are carrying a large amount of cash, even if it’s all 5’s and 1’s.  You become a target for thieves if your wallet is huge.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our > cruise budget. > Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should > we carry? > How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending > money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we > still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was > thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided > up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be > better to have more cash than cards? > Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting > ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that > has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, > so that’s a completely separate budget. > Anyway, what would you all suggest? > LES! > Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes > Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our cruise budget. Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should we carry? How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be better to have more cash than cards? Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, so that’s a completely separate budget. Anyway, what would you all suggest? LES! Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

Where are you cruising?  If it’s someplace that dollars are accepted, then $100 or $200 to start is fine, but if it’s someplace that dollars are not normally accepted, then you would want less cash and withdraw from an ATM in port to get local currency. Remember, each time you change dollars for local money, you will pay a hefty conversion fee.  It’s probably better to take it out in a local ATM in port unless you have a bank that charges a fortune for out of country transactions. Also, make sure you have a 4 digit PIN and you know it as numbers, not just letters, as many machines out of the US don’t have letters on the keys.  If your bank is still using a 6 digit PIN, just go in and ask they convert you to a 4. Don’t go too nuts with the small bills.  The purser’s desk can change big bills for you.  You don’t want it to look like you are carrying a large amount of cash, even if it’s all 5’s and 1’s.  You become a target for thieves if your wallet is huge.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our > cruise budget. > Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should > we carry? > How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending > money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we > still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was > thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided > up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be > better to have more cash than cards? > Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting > ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that > has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, > so that’s a completely separate budget. > Anyway, what would you all suggest? > LES! > Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes > Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

Try to carry a credit card that does NOT charge a premium for currency conversion.  Either read the fine print on your agreement or call your card company and ask them. The charge for purchases in non US$ currency can be from 0 to 2%.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We’re getting our last minute info and I needed to know how to divide our > cruise budget. > Not counting shore excursions or onboard spending, how much in cash should > we carry? > How would you divide this up? Say $500 (Although I believe our spending > money budget will be more like $1000. not completely positive yet as we > still have several large amount eBay payments we’re waiting for). I was > thinking $100 each in cash, small bills (5’s and 10’s) and the rest divided > up on debit cards? (We don’t do credit cards, only debit) Or would it be > better to have more cash than cards? > Not really going to worry about traveler’s checks as we’re not budgeting > ourselves much this time for spending money. We do have 1 debit card that > has a large balance so we can pay for onboard spending and shore excursions, > so that’s a completely separate budget. > Anyway, what would you all suggest? > LES! > Flight: 3 days 22 hours 7 minutes > Cruise: 5 days 4 hours 7 minutes

Response:

>We don’t do credit cards, only debit

Hi Les, You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of. Best regards, Ray LIGHTHOUSE TRAVEL 800-719-9917 or 805-566-3905 http://www.lighthousetravel.com

Response:

>We don’t do credit cards, only debit > Hi Les, > You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily > limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if > the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or > any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of.

Thanx Ray. I’ve actually already informed my bank that I have the large balance on. It’s actually the same card I used to pay for the cruise and airline tickets. So there was no need to tell them, but I wanted to be safe. LES!

Response:

Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you let them know.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >We don’t do credit cards, only debit > Hi Les, > You might want to keep in mind that most debit cards have a daily > limit.  You could run into difficulties at the end of the cruise if > the ship is trying to charge your week’s worth of onboard charges or > any other large purchases.  Just something to be aware of. > Thanx Ray. I’ve actually already informed my bank that I have the large > balance on. It’s actually the same card I used to pay for the cruise and > airline tickets. So there was no need to tell them, but I wanted to be safe. > LES!

Response:

>Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks >will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow >the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from >overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying >you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you >let them know.

Better tell them b/c even when you do, they freeze those buggers.

Response:

> Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and verifying > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you > let them know.

Mike, Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a hotel in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. –Jean

Response:

Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted virtually noplace outside of the United States. It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any other charges until they called Visa.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t follow > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in from > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > verifying > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good you > let them know. > Mike, > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a hotel > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > –Jean

Response:

The only problem with that, Mike, is if they put a hold on the card WHILE you are traveling and there is therefore no way to reach you. I do recall that a friend had her American Express Platinum card stopped while she was traveling with us through Alaska.  Fortunately she had a business and when AMEX called her secretary advised them that she was on vacation and that the charges were hers. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted virtually > noplace outside of the United States. > It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any other > charges until they called Visa. > > Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many banks > > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t > follow > > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in > from > > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > verifying > > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good > you > > let them know. > Mike, > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa called > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a > hotel > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > –Jean

Response:

When the card is refused, you call them.  That’s way faster then them calling you.  they can usually take off the hold while you are on the call and they can swipe your card again.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The only problem with that, Mike, is if they put a hold on the card WHILE > you are traveling and there is therefore no way to reach you. > I do recall that a friend had her American Express Platinum card stopped > while she was traveling with us through Alaska.  Fortunately she had a > business and when AMEX called her secretary advised them that she was on > vacation and that the charges were hers. > — > DG in Cherry Hill, NJ > Not really much of a need to let Discover know, they are accepted > virtually > noplace outside of the United States. > It’s good they called, we know people that they just put a stop on any > other > charges until they called Visa. > > > Depending on the bank, it may be a good thing you told them.  Many > banks > > > will freeze a card if their computer notices activity that doesn’t > follow > > > the usual pattern, for example if a bunch of charges start coming in > from > > > overseas.  Most of the time it’s just a matter of calling them and > > verifying > > > you are who you say you are and they release the holds, but it’s good > you > > > let them know. > > Mike, > > Two weeks ago, when I made reservations for a hotel in Venice, Visa > called > > me and told me that xxx amt of dollars had been put on our card from a > hotel > > in Italy and asked if they were authorized. I was very pleased that they > > were that cautious and informed her that we would be in Italy and the > > Mediterranean in May. She said that she would make a notation on our > > account. I usually notify Visa and Discover when we are traveling, > > especially overseas, but this time they beat me to it. > > –Jean

Response:

Question:

We used a taxi because of the luggage. The Vaporetto may or may not get you close to the ship depending on where it is docked. On the Canal side of the Hotel is a major Vaporetto stop where you can buy tickets which are good all day which is a real bargain. We rode the system all around the Lagoon late one night and it was fantastic. One of the things you will want to do is visit the glass factories on Murano. You can readily get there by Vaporetto but some of the Outlets will pay for a ride out via Water Taxi, hoping you will drop a wad of cash while there. Check with the Front Desk of your Hotel and they can arrange something I am sure. However you get there just be sure that you go and that you take a camera. It really is fascinating to see these old craftsmen in action. Just the ride over was fascinating. We saw a Fireboat racing across the lagoon with full lights and siren, we saw a Hearse Boat leading a procession of other boats, we saw a McDonalds Boat going from house to house along the small canals, and we saw another water taxi being pulled over and given a ticket by a Police Boat. There really is no other place like Venice. Have a great trip, Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at >http://www.hotelsantachiara.it > and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and >post > packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public > transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the > Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the >pier > when time to board the ship. > If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there >would be > other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this >one is > a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, >and have > never had a serious complaint. > Cal Ford > Lido Deck Cruises >Thanks, Cal, > It sounds like a great place and the photos of the rooms are very nice. >Decisions, decisions! How did you get to the ship’s pier from that location? >I notice one can drive or take a vaporetto. Which did you do? >Thanks so much for the information, >–Jean

Response:

> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

We’ve had the Londra Palace highly recommended & I was able to get a Jr. Suite there for less than a ROH room at the Cipriani, Danielli, etc.  It is also a 5 star, so fingers crossed!  Will let you know after June!

Response:

Venice hotels? Well, there is the good and the not so good about them, Jean…..IMHO….. The good is that they are mostly small so they have style and are not cookie cutter hotel chain look alikes…..plus you get warm personal service. The not so good is that they are mostly small so they fill up fast….and can charge quite a bit. Personally, It has been several years since Venice on family vacation, but  the REGINA  is a great classic….and my father on getting the bill for the rooms threatened to jump in the Grand Canal….LOL……more recently the METROPOL was delightful, especially to lovers of classical music as Vivaldi composed in  there….and several years ago the rooms were about 300 plus  dollars per……causing my father again to threaten that he would have to moonlight as a gondolier… Now, more up to date and what friends reccomended.  Last year  they stayed at a hotel they  got an internet rate of about 200 US dollars, very good location, classic facade, but  inside comfortable with modern baths,air condition, satellite TV etc…..it is the  HOTEL BONVECCHIATI. It is on the Calle Goldoni, good location……perhaps you can find  it also on the internet and with a good rate. Another one…….Several months ago, an acquaintance of mine said they were pleased with the not too expensive  HOTEL SCANDINAVIA, that is near the Londra, Metropol, etc…a small hotel, but in the Ventian style and Personally, the Danieli and the Gritti and the Excelsior type hotels are only worth their 500 and 600 US dollar per night tarifs if one is staying there for the full, all day enjoyment of the hotel and it’s amenities….not touristing around or using the hotel for a one or two night pre or apres cruise stop. ANGELICA

Response:

> BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where > Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten.

Hemingway sure had a lot of watering holes. — Charles

Response:

> Hemingway sure had a lot of watering holes.

You bet, Charles.  Seems like every other bar in Paris, Madrid, etc. was a regular hangout for this dude. Howie

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda > (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) > We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli > Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from > Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop > practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night > (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were > small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff > was > friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. > Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price > range. > We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by > tho. > Thanks, I checked and it is a lovely hotel~~however the rate is $390.95 a > night for the days that we need it! > –Jean

We liked the Albergo Bel Sito e Berlino Hotel Venice.  We stayed there a few nights before our cruise 3 years ago.  Not real fancy, but very homey and friendly.  And a short walk to San Marco.

Response:

We liked the Albergo Bel Sito e Berlino Hotel Venice.  We stayed there a few nights before our cruise 3 years ago.  Not real fancy, but very homey and friendly.  And a short walk to San Marco. Thanks, Cathy!  I have bookmarked the site. Will compare and decide between all the ones suggested here. –Jean

Response:

> Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all > the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive > yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med > cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience > and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the > Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on > real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance.

I agree, David, I want a 4-5 star  on the Grand Canal and they are a rather pricey, especially for three nights, but I’m bookmarking all the suggestions for Ed and I to later sit down, compare and select. > The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the > canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido > Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) > are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will > need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to > the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes > quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning > natural wood beauties, just like in the movies.

David, when we were in Venice last, it was on a land tour and the tour company took care of all the luggage. We took a water taxi to the hotel and I can’t remember how our luggage got there. That was why I wondered how our luggage, 2 larges suitcases and two carry ons would get there. I’m going to have to dig out some of the albums with photos of that trip to refresh my mind!  > Impossibly memorable experiences! I know, Venice is such a wonderful place! I hate it that it is sinking 2 1/2" every ten years!  Must be the billions of pigeons in St. Mark’s Square! <VBG> Just kidding!  It is sad; however. I appreciate your comments and if you think of anything else, do not hesitate to post or e-mail me privately. Thanks, –Jean

Response:

> Dear Jean,

 > What do you mean by a "good hotel"? Are you wanting a 5 star hotel? > Venice hotels are priced according to the season. I’m not sure when > your curise is, but that will be the defining issue.

Exactly~~a 4 or 5 star, hopefully on the Grand Canal and near St. Mark’s. Our cruise is on the Westerdam, beginning May 7th, 2004, for 12 days. So we will need a pre and post cruise hotel in Venice.  > We have stayed in Venice twice – once before a cruise and once on our > own. Both times were not high season and we found reasonable hotels > which were just what we wanted. But they were 3 star hotels and we > were lucky with our dates. The first hotel was $90 USD – including > buffet breakfast and all taxes (this was last of August 2002) and > doubled in price a week later. The second one was in March 2003 and > even cheaper. However I have looked at that website and found it much > higher – again depending on the date. > If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their > specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal.

Thanks for the web site above~I will study it.. .Never heard of it before. > Good luck and happy travels!

Thanks again! –Jean<~~~thinks rtc has some wonderful and helpful people.

Response:

> http://www.italyhotel.com/it/venezia/ala/ > We’ve stayed at the above.

Thanks, Bobbye~another one to bookmark! –Jean

Response:

> One thing I have learned in my travels. Never skimp on hotels in > European cities.

That’s very true, Charles, their hotel ratings are not the same as ours.We’ve been in many different types of hotels in Italy, Ireland and Poland. Some I would never go to again and some I’d love to go and stay for a long time! –Jean

Response:

You are right, there are hundreds of choices and valid reasons for selecting each one. The trick is to select the one which will be best for your purposes and intentions. With that in mind I will offer my suggestion. The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at http://www.hotelsantachiara.it and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and post packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the pier when time to board the ship. If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there would be other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this one is a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, and have never had a serious complaint. Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, >Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would >rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. >TIA, >–Jean

Response:

Answered inline:

> We stayed in the Hotel Torino, which is a 3 star hotel that was originally a > 15th century palazzo. At 320,000 lira per night in 2000, we had one of the > least expensive rooms available.

Now, we have to deal with euros in Italy. One US dollar is worth $.82 in Euros right now.. This will probably be our last cruise for this year as we have to get to Poland for a land visit before they go to euros next January! Consequently, we had a small room on the > 5th floor, which was reached by walking up the stairs.

When we were on our land trip there in 1992, the hotel we stayed in and that was chosen by our tour company, did not have any elevators and we had to schlepp our luggage up four flights up a windy staircase. Ended up in such a tiny room, we could not fit our luggage, so we complained to our tour guide, he looked at it and he threatened the front desk with no more tours being booked there unless they changed it. They did~ to a larger one facing the street. Very interesting~ people watching and viewing all the people shopping in the little shops below.. Made friends with a little elderly woman who lived across the street in an apartment at the same level as ours~mostly through sign language and waves! >There were several other much nicer rooms there. The only other hotel that I remember is the > Hotel Braun Gruenwald where my parents stayed 40 years earlier. We went in > to look around and it was magnificent. It may be a 5 star hotel, but I am > not sure.  It has a patio deck on on the Grand Canal where the gondolas tie > up. In 1960 when my parents were there on their first trip to Europe they > were picked up at the train station by gondola.  What a fantastic beginning > to a stay in Venice that must have been.

Would that by any chance be the 5 star Bauer Hotel now? I got a private e-mail from someone suggesting that one and it looks like a beauty! > BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where > Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten. My parents had also stopped in there > for a drink 40 years earlier. I am sure that the prices have gone up, as > this was the most expensive spot in all of Italy it turns out. A whisky and > ginger ale was 24, 000 lira ($12 in 2000) while a Bellini was 22,000 lira. > Still, you can’t beat the atmosphere. Don’t even think of eating there > unless you carry your money around in large bills.

 LOL! sounds interesting! Will try and find it. With all the warnings of pick pockets, I hope they accept credit cards! I did not see any pick pockets on our other two visits to Italy. But they do say there are groups of gypsies who distract tourists so that their cohorts can pick their pockets~never had it happen to me though. One just has to be careful no matter where in the world one goes. I was robbed in Bayamon, Puerto Rico once though. That’s another story! > Jean, it seems as if you go from one cruise to another. Must be fantastic.

It is fantastic, Robert, I really feel blessed ~we cruised in Nov, Jan and Feb.and will again in May, but as I said earlier, we’ll probably try and get in two land trips this year while our health is still good. > All the best,

Robert Thanks for your help, Robert. Best to you too, –Jean

Response:

> The Danieli, Griti Palace, Luna Baglioni or the Metropole > are worthy of your consideration. > Judy

Thanks, Judy, but unless we get a special rate, those are a bit pricey! Who knows?? We may be surprised! –Jean

Response:

> The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at

http://www.hotelsantachiara.it – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and post > packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public > transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the > Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the pier > when time to board the ship. > If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there would be > other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this one is > a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, and have > never had a serious complaint. > Cal Ford > Lido Deck Cruises

Thanks, Cal,  It sounds like a great place and the photos of the rooms are very nice. Decisions, decisions! How did you get to the ship’s pier from that location? I notice one can drive or take a vaporetto. Which did you do? Thanks so much for the information, –Jean

Response:

The Danieli, Griti Palace, Luna Baglioni or the Metropole are worthy of your consideration. > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

– Judy Peter Berlin’s Travel Center – http://peterberlin.com The GLC2005 January 2, 2005 800-874-6040 / 954-974-6040

Response:

Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance. The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning natural wood beauties, just like in the movies. Impossibly memorable experiences! David – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

Dear Jean, What do you mean by a "good hotel"? Are you wanting a 5 star hotel? Venice hotels are priced according to the season. I’m not sure when your curise is, but that will be the defining issue. We have stayed in Venice twice – once before a cruise and once on our own. Both times were not high season and we found reasonable hotels which were just what we wanted. But they were 3 star hotels and we were lucky with our dates. The first hotel was $90 USD – including buffet breakfast and all taxes (this was last of August 2002) and doubled in price a week later. The second one was in March 2003 and even cheaper. However I have looked at that website and found it much higher – again depending on the date. If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal. Good luck and happy travels! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all > the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive > yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med > cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience > and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the > Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on > real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance. > The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the > canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido > Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) > are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will > need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to > the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes > quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning > natural wood beauties, just like in the movies. > Impossibly memorable experiences! > David > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

http://www.italyhotel.com/it/venezia/ala/ We’ve stayed at the above. Bobbye

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

> If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their > specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal.

One thing I have learned in my travels. Never skimp on hotels in European cities. — Charles

Response:

We stayed in the Hotel Torino, which is a 3 star hotel that was originally a 15th century palazzo. At 320,000 lira per night in 2000, we had one of the least expensive rooms available. Consequently, we had a small room on the 5th floor, which was reached by walking up the stairs. There were several other much nicer rooms there. The only other hotel that I remember is the Hotel Braun Gruenwald where my parents stayed 40 years earlier. We went in to look around and it was magnificent. It may be a 5 star hotel, but I am not sure.  It has a patio deck on on the Grand Canal where the gondolas tie up. In 1960 when my parents were there on their first trip to Europe they were picked up at the train station by gondola.  What a fantastic beginning to a stay in Venice that must have been. BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten. My parents had also stopped in there for a drink 40 years earlier. I am sure that the prices have gone up, as this was the most expensive spot in all of Italy it turns out. A whisky and ginger ale was 24, 000 lira ($12 in 2000) while a Bellini was 22,000 lira. Still, you can’t beat the atmosphere. Don’t even think of eating there unless you carry your money around in large bills. Jean, it seems as if you go from one cruise to another. Must be fantastic. All the best, Robert

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. TIA, –Jean

Response:

You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff was friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price range. We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by tho. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda > (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) > We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli > Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from > Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop > practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night > (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were > small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff was > friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. > Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price range. > We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by > tho.

Thanks, I checked and it is a lovely hotel~~however the rate is $390.95 a night for the days that we need it! –Jean

Response:

Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. TIA, –Jean

Response:

You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff was friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price range. We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by tho. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda > (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) > We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli > Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from > Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop > practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night > (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were > small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff was > friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. > Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price range. > We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by > tho.

Thanks, I checked and it is a lovely hotel~~however the rate is $390.95 a night for the days that we need it! –Jean

Response:

The Danieli, Griti Palace, Luna Baglioni or the Metropole are worthy of your consideration. > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

– Judy Peter Berlin’s Travel Center – http://peterberlin.com The GLC2005 January 2, 2005 800-874-6040 / 954-974-6040

Response:

Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance. The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning natural wood beauties, just like in the movies. Impossibly memorable experiences! David – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

Dear Jean, What do you mean by a "good hotel"? Are you wanting a 5 star hotel? Venice hotels are priced according to the season. I’m not sure when your curise is, but that will be the defining issue. We have stayed in Venice twice – once before a cruise and once on our own. Both times were not high season and we found reasonable hotels which were just what we wanted. But they were 3 star hotels and we were lucky with our dates. The first hotel was $90 USD – including buffet breakfast and all taxes (this was last of August 2002) and doubled in price a week later. The second one was in March 2003 and even cheaper. However I have looked at that website and found it much higher – again depending on the date. If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal. Good luck and happy travels! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all > the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive > yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med > cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience > and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the > Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on > real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance. > The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the > canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido > Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) > are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will > need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to > the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes > quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning > natural wood beauties, just like in the movies. > Impossibly memorable experiences! > David > Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

http://www.italyhotel.com/it/venezia/ala/ We’ve stayed at the above. Bobbye

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

> If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their > specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal.

One thing I have learned in my travels. Never skimp on hotels in European cities. — Charles

Response:

We stayed in the Hotel Torino, which is a 3 star hotel that was originally a 15th century palazzo. At 320,000 lira per night in 2000, we had one of the least expensive rooms available. Consequently, we had a small room on the 5th floor, which was reached by walking up the stairs. There were several other much nicer rooms there. The only other hotel that I remember is the Hotel Braun Gruenwald where my parents stayed 40 years earlier. We went in to look around and it was magnificent. It may be a 5 star hotel, but I am not sure.  It has a patio deck on on the Grand Canal where the gondolas tie up. In 1960 when my parents were there on their first trip to Europe they were picked up at the train station by gondola.  What a fantastic beginning to a stay in Venice that must have been. BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten. My parents had also stopped in there for a drink 40 years earlier. I am sure that the prices have gone up, as this was the most expensive spot in all of Italy it turns out. A whisky and ginger ale was 24, 000 lira ($12 in 2000) while a Bellini was 22,000 lira. Still, you can’t beat the atmosphere. Don’t even think of eating there unless you carry your money around in large bills. Jean, it seems as if you go from one cruise to another. Must be fantastic. All the best, Robert

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

Response:

> BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where > Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten.

Hemingway sure had a lot of watering holes. — Charles

Response:

> Hemingway sure had a lot of watering holes.

You bet, Charles.  Seems like every other bar in Paris, Madrid, etc. was a regular hangout for this dude. Howie

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You might want to consider the Savoie & Jolanda > (http://www.hotelsavoiajolanda.it/) > We stayed there two years ago after our R5 cruise. It’s on the Riva degli > Schiavoni with the Venice Lagoon right in front and about a block from > Piazza San Marco. Two doors down from the Danieli. Vaporetto stop > practically right in front of the hotel. Prices were under $200/night > (through Hotel Reservation Network) and breakfast was included. Rooms were > small, as are most European hotels, but clean and well appointed. Staff > was > friendly and helpful. You really can’t beat the location. > Would have preferred the Danieli, of course, but way out of the price > range. > We did have Bellinis on the roof top bar and watched the Rotterdam sail by > tho. > Thanks, I checked and it is a lovely hotel~~however the rate is $390.95 a > night for the days that we need it! > –Jean

We liked the Albergo Bel Sito e Berlino Hotel Venice.  We stayed there a few nights before our cruise 3 years ago.  Not real fancy, but very homey and friendly.  And a short walk to San Marco.

Response:

We liked the Albergo Bel Sito e Berlino Hotel Venice.  We stayed there a few nights before our cruise 3 years ago.  Not real fancy, but very homey and friendly.  And a short walk to San Marco. Thanks, Cathy!  I have bookmarked the site. Will compare and decide between all the ones suggested here. –Jean

Response:

> Venice is not a place to try to save money!  First of all it takes all > the fun out of it and second you won’t succeed but will deprive > yourself of much. I stayed at the Hotel Gritti Palace prior to my Med > cruise.  It was expensive but well worth it in terms of convenience > and style.  Breakfast on the canal-side deck directly across from the > Salute is probably one of life’s most memorable events.  Sleeping on > real linen sheets was also an outstanding extravagance.

I agree, David, I want a 4-5 star  on the Grand Canal and they are a rather pricey, especially for three nights, but I’m bookmarking all the suggestions for Ed and I to later sit down, compare and select. > The Danieli (two doors down from the Gritti) , Cipriani (across the > canal from the Danieli and Gritti) and the Excelsior (out on Lido > Island, the place for which Lido decks on ships everywhere are named) > are also exceptional.  BTW, no matter which one you stay at you will > need the services of a private water taxi to get from your hotel to > the Statzione Maritima.  Again, this is a Venice classic and makes > quite a statement as you arrive at the pier in one of these stunning > natural wood beauties, just like in the movies.

David, when we were in Venice last, it was on a land tour and the tour company took care of all the luggage. We took a water taxi to the hotel and I can’t remember how our luggage got there. That was why I wondered how our luggage, 2 larges suitcases and two carry ons would get there. I’m going to have to dig out some of the albums with photos of that trip to refresh my mind!  > Impossibly memorable experiences! I know, Venice is such a wonderful place! I hate it that it is sinking 2 1/2" every ten years!  Must be the billions of pigeons in St. Mark’s Square! <VBG> Just kidding!  It is sad; however. I appreciate your comments and if you think of anything else, do not hesitate to post or e-mail me privately. Thanks, –Jean

Response:

> Dear Jean,

 > What do you mean by a "good hotel"? Are you wanting a 5 star hotel? > Venice hotels are priced according to the season. I’m not sure when > your curise is, but that will be the defining issue.

Exactly~~a 4 or 5 star, hopefully on the Grand Canal and near St. Mark’s. Our cruise is on the Westerdam, beginning May 7th, 2004, for 12 days. So we will need a pre and post cruise hotel in Venice.  > We have stayed in Venice twice – once before a cruise and once on our > own. Both times were not high season and we found reasonable hotels > which were just what we wanted. But they were 3 star hotels and we > were lucky with our dates. The first hotel was $90 USD – including > buffet breakfast and all taxes (this was last of August 2002) and > doubled in price a week later. The second one was in March 2003 and > even cheaper. However I have looked at that website and found it much > higher – again depending on the date. > If you are not set on 5 Stars, try ITWG.com and look for their > specials. We lucked in to a buy 3 nights -4th night free sort of deal.

Thanks for the web site above~I will study it.. .Never heard of it before. > Good luck and happy travels!

Thanks again! –Jean<~~~thinks rtc has some wonderful and helpful people.

Response:

> http://www.italyhotel.com/it/venezia/ala/ > We’ve stayed at the above.

Thanks, Bobbye~another one to bookmark! –Jean

Response:

> One thing I have learned in my travels. Never skimp on hotels in > European cities.

That’s very true, Charles, their hotel ratings are not the same as ours.We’ve been in many different types of hotels in Italy, Ireland and Poland. Some I would never go to again and some I’d love to go and stay for a long time! –Jean

Response:

You are right, there are hundreds of choices and valid reasons for selecting each one. The trick is to select the one which will be best for your purposes and intentions. With that in mind I will offer my suggestion. The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at http://www.hotelsantachiara.it and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and post packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the pier when time to board the ship. If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there would be other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this one is a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, and have never had a serious complaint. Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, >Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would >rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. >TIA, >–Jean

Response:

Answered inline:

> We stayed in the Hotel Torino, which is a 3 star hotel that was originally a > 15th century palazzo. At 320,000 lira per night in 2000, we had one of the > least expensive rooms available.

Now, we have to deal with euros in Italy. One US dollar is worth $.82 in Euros right now.. This will probably be our last cruise for this year as we have to get to Poland for a land visit before they go to euros next January! Consequently, we had a small room on the > 5th floor, which was reached by walking up the stairs.

When we were on our land trip there in 1992, the hotel we stayed in and that was chosen by our tour company, did not have any elevators and we had to schlepp our luggage up four flights up a windy staircase. Ended up in such a tiny room, we could not fit our luggage, so we complained to our tour guide, he looked at it and he threatened the front desk with no more tours being booked there unless they changed it. They did~ to a larger one facing the street. Very interesting~ people watching and viewing all the people shopping in the little shops below.. Made friends with a little elderly woman who lived across the street in an apartment at the same level as ours~mostly through sign language and waves! >There were several other much nicer rooms there. The only other hotel that I remember is the > Hotel Braun Gruenwald where my parents stayed 40 years earlier. We went in > to look around and it was magnificent. It may be a 5 star hotel, but I am > not sure.  It has a patio deck on on the Grand Canal where the gondolas tie > up. In 1960 when my parents were there on their first trip to Europe they > were picked up at the train station by gondola.  What a fantastic beginning > to a stay in Venice that must have been.

Would that by any chance be the 5 star Bauer Hotel now? I got a private e-mail from someone suggesting that one and it looks like a beauty! > BTW, you must visit Harry’s Bar in San Marco, a famous watering hole where > Ernest Hemingway and others have eaten. My parents had also stopped in there > for a drink 40 years earlier. I am sure that the prices have gone up, as > this was the most expensive spot in all of Italy it turns out. A whisky and > ginger ale was 24, 000 lira ($12 in 2000) while a Bellini was 22,000 lira. > Still, you can’t beat the atmosphere. Don’t even think of eating there > unless you carry your money around in large bills.

 LOL! sounds interesting! Will try and find it. With all the warnings of pick pockets, I hope they accept credit cards! I did not see any pick pockets on our other two visits to Italy. But they do say there are groups of gypsies who distract tourists so that their cohorts can pick their pockets~never had it happen to me though. One just has to be careful no matter where in the world one goes. I was robbed in Bayamon, Puerto Rico once though. That’s another story! > Jean, it seems as if you go from one cruise to another. Must be fantastic.

It is fantastic, Robert, I really feel blessed ~we cruised in Nov, Jan and Feb.and will again in May, but as I said earlier, we’ll probably try and get in two land trips this year while our health is still good. > All the best,

Robert Thanks for your help, Robert. Best to you too, –Jean

Response:

> The Danieli, Griti Palace, Luna Baglioni or the Metropole > are worthy of your consideration. > Judy

Thanks, Judy, but unless we get a special rate, those are a bit pricey! Who knows?? We may be surprised! –Jean

Response:

> The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at

http://www.hotelsantachiara.it – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and post > packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public > transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the > Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the pier > when time to board the ship. > If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there would be > other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this one is > a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, and have > never had a serious complaint. > Cal Ford > Lido Deck Cruises

Thanks, Cal,  It sounds like a great place and the photos of the rooms are very nice. Decisions, decisions! How did you get to the ship’s pier from that location? I notice one can drive or take a vaporetto. Which did you do? Thanks so much for the information, –Jean

Response:

We used a taxi because of the luggage. The Vaporetto may or may not get you close to the ship depending on where it is docked. On the Canal side of the Hotel is a major Vaporetto stop where you can buy tickets which are good all day which is a real bargain. We rode the system all around the Lagoon late one night and it was fantastic. One of the things you will want to do is visit the glass factories on Murano. You can readily get there by Vaporetto but some of the Outlets will pay for a ride out via Water Taxi, hoping you will drop a wad of cash while there. Check with the Front Desk of your Hotel and they can arrange something I am sure. However you get there just be sure that you go and that you take a camera. It really is fascinating to see these old craftsmen in action. Just the ride over was fascinating. We saw a Fireboat racing across the lagoon with full lights and siren, we saw a Hearse Boat leading a procession of other boats, we saw a McDonalds Boat going from house to house along the small canals, and we saw another water taxi being pulled over and given a ticket by a Police Boat. There really is no other place like Venice. Have a great trip, Cal Ford Lido Deck Cruises says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The Hotel Santa Chiara which can be researched at >http://www.hotelsantachiara.it > and other places as well I am sure. We use this hotel a lot for pre and >post > packages because it is the only one that I know of that has good public > transportation both by land and by water. You can arrive by taxi from the > Airport, tour the city by water during your stay, and take a taxi to the >pier > when time to board the ship. > If you were going to Venice solely and not taking a cruise then there >would be > other hotels better suited but for what you are looking for I think this >one is > a good match. We have put many clients there, in addition to ourselves, >and have > never had a serious complaint. > Cal Ford > Lido Deck Cruises >Thanks, Cal, > It sounds like a great place and the photos of the rooms are very nice. >Decisions, decisions! How did you get to the ship’s pier from that location? >I notice one can drive or take a vaporetto. Which did you do? >Thanks so much for the information, >–Jean

Response:

> Does anyone have any experience or knowledge of a good hotel in Venice, > Italy, for a pre and post cruise?  I see many when researching but would > rather book one that someone has personally used and recommends. > TIA, > –Jean

We’ve had the Londra Palace highly recommended & I was able to get a Jr. Suite there for less than a ROH room at the Cipriani, Danielli, etc.  It is also a 5 star, so fingers crossed!  Will let you know after June!

Response:

Venice hotels? Well, there is the good and the not so good about them, Jean…..IMHO….. The good is that they are mostly small so they have style and are not cookie cutter hotel chain look alikes…..plus you get warm personal service. The not so good is that they are mostly small so they fill up fast….and can charge quite a bit. Personally, It has been several years since Venice on family vacation, but  the REGINA  is a great classic….and my father on getting the bill for the rooms threatened to jump in the Grand Canal….LOL……more recently the METROPOL was delightful, especially to lovers of classical music as Vivaldi composed in  there….and several years ago the rooms were about 300 plus  dollars per……causing my father again to threaten that he would have to moonlight as a gondolier… Now, more up to date and what friends reccomended.  Last year  they stayed at a hotel they  got an internet rate of about 200 US dollars, very good location, classic facade, but  inside comfortable with modern baths,air condition, satellite TV etc…..it is the  HOTEL BONVECCHIATI. It is on the Calle Goldoni, good location……perhaps you can find  it also on the internet and with a good rate. Another one…….Several months ago, an acquaintance of mine said they were pleased with the not too expensive  HOTEL SCANDINAVIA, that is near the Londra, Metropol, etc…a small hotel, but in the Ventian style and Personally, the Danieli and the Gritti and the Excelsior type hotels are only worth their 500 and 600 US dollar per night tarifs if one is staying there for the full, all day enjoyment of the hotel and it’s amenities….not touristing around or using the hotel for a one or two night pre or apres cruise stop. ANGELICA

Response:

Question:

We love :  good food, diverse crowds, a great kids program and an interesting intinerary. We are 3 time Celebrity cruisers who like the Lirica’s intinerary for the dates we are looking at. You all talked me out of Costa because since great food is important to us, apparently they are lacking in that area. Any recent MSC cruisers out there care to give their point of view? Thanks in advance. Sue

Response:

We considered the Lirica for our family this summer. Amazing, I still have this link–it is a compilation of links to Lirica reviews. http://cruiseclues.com/lirica/reviews.htm I gather the onboard experience will be very European. That’s not a bad thing at all–except for one factor which was a biggie for us: expect lots of smoking. Another thing to consider is how comfortable (or not) your kids might be if they are a minority of sorts in the kids program groups. Generally, kids seem to work all of that out very nicely on their own, but sometimes it does take a day or two. It might be harder for a child who is, by nature, shy or less confident about his/her social skills. Good luck in making your decision! Ultimately, for a variety of reasons, we decided on the Celeb Millennium doing an attractive 12-night Med itin. Diana Ball near Houston, TX – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >We love :  good food, diverse crowds, a great kids program and an interesting >intinerary. We are 3 time Celebrity cruisers who like the Lirica’s intinerary >for the dates we are looking at. >You all talked me out of Costa because since great food is important to us, >apparently they are lacking in that area. >Any recent MSC cruisers out there care to give their point of view? >Thanks in advance. >Sue

Response:

Oops, I just read the full message header and realized by your reference to the Summit that you must be thinking about trying the Lirica in the Carib? If that’s the case, then ignore my comments. IIRC, from what I read when looking at the Lirica for summer back in her home Med waters, her onboard character changes when she comes to the Med because the pax make-up includes more Americans and Brits. You should be able to access some helpful reviews from the link I mentioned. Diana Ball near Houston, TX

Response:

>Good luck in making your decision! Ultimately, for a variety of reasons, >we decided on the Celeb Millennium doing an attractive 12-night Med itin.

Diana We sailed the Millie on Thanksgiving. Great ship. Enjoy! Sue

Response:

Check out the message board comments on cruisecritic.com. Unfortunately they are not very favorable for the Lirica. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Good luck in making your decision! Ultimately, for a variety of reasons, >we decided on the Celeb Millennium doing an attractive 12-night Med itin. > Diana > We sailed the Millie on Thanksgiving. Great ship. > Enjoy! > Sue

Response:

>No Sour cream on a baked potato? people don’t eat >sour cream on baked potatos

in Europe. I wasn’t aware they ate baked potatoes, either.  I’ve spent a great deal of time in Europe, on the continent, including living there, and of all the ways potatoes were used, I never encountered a baked one.

Response:

We are a European (kind of…) couple, I am Italian-American (1st generation) and my husband is French. Though we would still like to give the Lirica a shot, we went ahead and booked the Island Princess because we simply got a better deal. Thanks for the input! Sue

Response:

>>But an American lady on our cruise did. She ordered ‘French

Toast’ for breakfast and was up in arms because she got real European "French Toast" and not the pancakes covered in Maple Syrup one has in the US:) Quite funny listening to her rattle on<< Not having, ever, ordered French Toast on ANY cruiseline I can’t say what should be expected..BUT, french toast, anywhere, in the USA is, definately NOT pancakes! Though, they both come dripping in maple syrup. Not really, syrup is served on the side, but most people love to see them drippin’. Eileen — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

Just got back from the 11 day (01/26 sailing) in the Western Carribean.  Spend your money well, take the Celebirity. We are frequent cruisers and this cruise was the absolute worse in terms of quality and variety of food, service, personnel was rude to put it mildly, no redeeming qualities except a very nice cabin which we spent a lot of time in because of the lack of activities on board. I doubt this ship will be back in the Carribean next year.

Response:

I wrote to the OP: > > >Ultimately, for a variety of reasons, we decided on the Celeb Millennium

doing an attractive 12-night Med itin. >In the Med I would pick a European ship.. why not, it’s Europe, >experience the customs. In the Caribbean or the US I pick a US based >line, experience the US way. Round Britain, N Europe, take a British >based ship. All are different and it makes things more interesting. >– >Pam

Pam, I agree 100% with your enthusiasm for the idea of Americans getting out of their skins and trying to "do as the Romans do" when traveling. Nonetheless, I, personally, don’t think a cruise ship of any stripe offers a representative experience of a particular culture.   Further, a Med. cruise features such a port-intensive itin., the ship is almost irrelevant except that it needs to well-serve the function of floating hotel & restaurant–for us, then, the choice was keyed first to itinerary, second to accommodations & dining, and third to price. The fact was, the Euro lines’ itineraries weren’t ideal for what we wanted to achieve with the cruise segment of a bigger, 4+ week trip. Moreoever, I wasn’t about to risk our comfort on that travel segment to a smokey environment (most of the reviews of the Lirica echo that, your experience notwithstanding) and lousy food (again, most pax–not just Americans–note the overall food quality is just fair save the Italian dishes, natch) just for the sake of making what some might consider the more "PC" cultural selection. Don’t get me wrong, the Lirica (and the MSC line generally) was very intriguing to me, probably more so than most Euro lines because I’m crazy about anything Italian. (I love Italy so much my husband has said he wouldn’t go back with me ’til I saw some other parts of the world first! Well, I managed to slip in some pre-cruise time in Venice + a few Italian ports by selecting the Millie cruise, so I’m a very happy camper.) But I definitely don’t feel as though our experience will be compromised by not having chosen the Lirica or some other Euro line. Indeed, I rather imagine that spending some time on a Celebrity ship will be a welcome thing that juncture in our travels. —> Having expectations that you can count on being met can be a very good thing when you’re on the road. Happy travels! Diana Ball Near Houston, TX http://www.dianaball.net Next up: Celebrity Millennium

Question:

Dear Craig, After experiencing similar frustrations, I decided not to book ahead, but that was for February travel, and I would want to have reservations for your dates. It is NOT possible to book on the Trenitalia site from other countries, as far as I know. My solution: ask one of your hotels or friends in Italy for the name of a reliable Travel Agency that can speak your language. They can book and hold, or send the tickets to you. Best of luck, Debbie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I want to book online some rail journeys in Italy but the Trenitalia website > is an exercise in frustration.  Specifically, I want to book Nice-Levanto on > 29 May, Siena-Venice on 13 June and Venice-Rosenheim on 16 June.  The > Trenitalia website gives timetable information but I cannot book anything, > as I need to register for their online ticket office and when I click on the > registration button it says "this service is temporarily suspended" – it’s > said that since January! > I’ve tried booking through Die Bahn and SNCF for some of the trips but it > seems that I cannot book trips in other countries.  I can book Nice-Genoa on > SNCF but with a two hour connection at Ventimiglia to catch the IC train > that the Trenitalia website shows originating in Nice. > Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given > that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European > rail booking office I can go to? > TIA > Craig > — > Please remove ‘345′ to contact me as I’m sick of junk email.

Response:

said… > Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given > that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European > rail booking office I can go to?

Several European rail agencies here in the UK I’m sure would be delighted to have your custom: www.europeanrail.co.uk www.trainseurope.co.uk www.railchoice.co.uk www.international-rail.com www.thetravelbureau.co.uk www.traxaway.com — Phil Richards London, N4

Response:

I want to book online some rail journeys in Italy but the Trenitalia website is an exercise in frustration.  Specifically, I want to book Nice-Levanto on 29 May, Siena-Venice on 13 June and Venice-Rosenheim on 16 June.  The Trenitalia website gives timetable information but I cannot book anything, as I need to register for their online ticket office and when I click on the registration button it says "this service is temporarily suspended" – it’s said that since January! I’ve tried booking through Die Bahn and SNCF for some of the trips but it seems that I cannot book trips in other countries.  I can book Nice-Genoa on SNCF but with a two hour connection at Ventimiglia to catch the IC train that the Trenitalia website shows originating in Nice. Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European rail booking office I can go to? TIA Craig — Please remove ‘345′ to contact me as I’m sick of junk email.

Response:

I want to book online some rail journeys in Italy but the Trenitalia website is an exercise in frustration.  Specifically, I want to book Nice-Levanto on 29 May, Siena-Venice on 13 June and Venice-Rosenheim on 16 June.  The Trenitalia website gives timetable information but I cannot book anything, as I need to register for their online ticket office and when I click on the registration button it says "this service is temporarily suspended" – it’s said that since January! I’ve tried booking through Die Bahn and SNCF for some of the trips but it seems that I cannot book trips in other countries.  I can book Nice-Genoa on SNCF but with a two hour connection at Ventimiglia to catch the IC train that the Trenitalia website shows originating in Nice. Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European rail booking office I can go to? TIA Craig — Please remove ‘345′ to contact me as I’m sick of junk email.

Response:

Dear Craig, After experiencing similar frustrations, I decided not to book ahead, but that was for February travel, and I would want to have reservations for your dates. It is NOT possible to book on the Trenitalia site from other countries, as far as I know. My solution: ask one of your hotels or friends in Italy for the name of a reliable Travel Agency that can speak your language. They can book and hold, or send the tickets to you. Best of luck, Debbie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I want to book online some rail journeys in Italy but the Trenitalia website > is an exercise in frustration.  Specifically, I want to book Nice-Levanto on > 29 May, Siena-Venice on 13 June and Venice-Rosenheim on 16 June.  The > Trenitalia website gives timetable information but I cannot book anything, > as I need to register for their online ticket office and when I click on the > registration button it says "this service is temporarily suspended" – it’s > said that since January! > I’ve tried booking through Die Bahn and SNCF for some of the trips but it > seems that I cannot book trips in other countries.  I can book Nice-Genoa on > SNCF but with a two hour connection at Ventimiglia to catch the IC train > that the Trenitalia website shows originating in Nice. > Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given > that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European > rail booking office I can go to? > TIA > Craig > — > Please remove ‘345′ to contact me as I’m sick of junk email.

Response:

said… > Is it possible to book these journies online through another avenue?  Given > that two of the trips cross national borders is their a central European > rail booking office I can go to?

Several European rail agencies here in the UK I’m sure would be delighted to have your custom: www.europeanrail.co.uk www.trainseurope.co.uk www.railchoice.co.uk www.international-rail.com www.thetravelbureau.co.uk www.traxaway.com — Phil Richards London, N4

Response:

Question:

>A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice >and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart >enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.

Your first class ticket from Milan to Venice gives you access to any of several (2 per hour during parts of the day) trains running from Milan to Venice every day that your ticket is valid. Do you really expect them to hold a seat for you on all these trains? — Ask me for directions.

Response:

"Tim" wrote | And probably the car wouldn’t have had A/C. Then you’d still | be stupid, but there’s be no-one else to see it.  ;-) There’s be no-one else to see you take your clothes off in the heat, either Owain

Response:

> In Austria you don’t actually have to have a ticket when you board, so you > can buy th eticket on the train plus a small "administration fee".

The administration fee is EUR 3. If there is no possibility to buy the ticket at the station, you don’t need to pay the administration fee. > This also applies to upgrading to 1st class.

Also in this case NO administration fee has to be payed. — Regards, Helmut Uttenthaler Graz – Austria

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice >> and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart >> enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We >> ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 >> hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. >> BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. >> Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. > In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and > 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t > blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. > Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning. > However usually it’s not working, apparently.      And/or the crowd > feels it’s way too cold and turns it off? > (OK, maybe not in the Eurostar.)

I’ve only once found a Eurostar car where the air conditioning wasn’t working. The conductor transferred us all to cars with working air conditioning; I ended up in first class. Most IC trains I’ve been in didn’t have air conditioning. I don’t know if this is true systemwide. Barbara

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. > In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and > 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t > blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. > Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning.

However usually it’s not working, apparently.      And/or the crowd feels it’s way too cold and turns it off? (OK, maybe not in the Eurostar.)

Response:

In addition its a lot quieter, wider seats and nothing like as busy. In Switz its not that much more expensive than 2nd. I go first when I go skiing because with a Halbtax Abo its worth it. Italy is cheap anyhow. UK forget it. Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Dennis, > First class is to be recommended for > -Businessmen or -women, whose employer authorizes firsz class travel (still cheaper than by > car), or others with the necessary ressources willing to spend it for a little additional comfort: > sometimes, FC also has plugs for PC and other electrical devices > -Oversize people, that don’t fit into a second-class seat > -Travel during peak periods, especially in poorer countries, where trains can get very > crowded in 2nd class > -peole that believe in class-difference (knighthood, tennis professionals or polo players, > investment bankers, lawyers and other impostors) > For all others, second class travel in Europe should be OK, particularly when traveling outside > rush hours (Friay and Sunday evenings, or the start of a vacation period are worst). > RH > –

Response:

 couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that. We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I

guess. And probably the car wouldn’t have had A/C. Then you’d still be stupid, but there’s be no-one else to see it.  ;-) Tim.

Response:

>I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into >the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class >and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps >only on longer trips?

Because it costs more, first class is usually less crowded. And the seats are bigger and usually in better condition. Plus if you’re over 26 and buy a Eurail pass, you’re required to get a first class pass. A truly cool book: The World Is Already Yours Conscious living in the real world www.alreadyyours.com (sample chapter, etc…)

Response:

> > As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by > train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I > didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next > time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But > no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second > class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure > seats together. > I have upgraded on the train in Italy, but I don’t want to speak for > other countries. The original question was about Italy. However, it > should be the same thing as getting on the train without a ticket, which > in most countries means you pay the fare plus a penalty. The only > difference is that they should credit you with the amount you paid for > the second class ticket.

In Austria you don’t actually have to have a ticket when you board, so you can buy th eticket on the train plus a small "administration fee". This also applies to upgrading to 1st class. If you have a 2nd-class ticket you’ll get to pay just the difference. Tim.

Response:

> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess.

In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning. Barbara

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks everybody for the responses. Sounds like unless you > have money to burn, second class is the way to go -reserving > an on-train upgrade to first if it is too crowded. > -Dennis > > I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st > class > > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or > perhaps > > only on longer trips? > > Thanks > > Dennis > Dennis, > For tips on using the trains see my page at > http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm > John Bermont > — >    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. Bruce

Response:

> As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by > train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I > didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next > time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But > no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second > class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure > seats together.

I have upgraded on the train in Italy, but I don’t want to speak for other countries. The original question was about Italy. However, it should be the same thing as getting on the train without a ticket, which in most countries means you pay the fare plus a penalty. The only difference is that they should credit you with the amount you paid for the second class ticket. I usually don’t reserve, even in 2nd class. However, on a really long trip, with several people travelling together I might do so. Not all trains, however, have the possibility of reserving seats. Barbara

Response:

As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure seats together. FWIW, my ex-parents in law took the kids by train first class and my daughters didn’t even notice a difference. Safe travels Liz — Posted via http://britishexpats.com

Response:

Thanks everybody for the responses. Sounds like unless you have money to burn, second class is the way to go -reserving an on-train upgrade to first if it is too crowded. -Dennis

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis > Dennis, > For tips on using the trains see my page at > http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm > John Bermont > — >    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis >Dennis, >For tips on using the trains see my page at >http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm >John Bermont >– >   * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >             http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Dennis, First class is to be recommended for -Businessmen or -women, whose employer authorizes firsz class travel (still cheaper than by car), or others with the necessary ressources willing to spend it for a little additional comfort: sometimes, FC also has plugs for PC and other electrical devices -Oversize people, that don’t fit into a second-class seat -Travel during peak periods, especially in poorer countries, where trains can get very crowded in 2nd class -peole that believe in class-difference (knighthood, tennis professionals or polo players, investment bankers, lawyers and other impostors) For all others, second class travel in Europe should be OK, particularly when traveling outside rush hours (Friay and Sunday evenings, or the start of a vacation period are worst). RH –

Response:

sit in first class if you want to sit with a bunch of  snobs who won’t talk to you. regards, Mark Holden

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into >the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class >and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps >only on longer trips? > While the seats may be marginally more comfortable in first class, I don’t > think that’s the main reason that someone would pay the extra. In most cases > it would be to get away from the crowds. > So it’s worth checking out in advance whether the train you travel on is > likely to be full in second class, leaving you either jammed up against > someone else’s legs – or without a seat at all – if you can. If you’ve > got the time, and you’re in a town for a number of days, maybe take a look > at the same train on an earlier day and see how many people are on it, as > it leaves the station.

As I noted in another post, you can decide to upgrade once you’re on the train if 2nd class is too crowded. You pay a penalty for upgrading on the train, but it’s certainly more convenient than going to the station the day before to scope out the trains. Actually, if you’re travelling on a Friday, the conditions on Thursday wouldn’t be a very good predictor. Barbara

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis

Dennis, For tips on using the trains see my page at http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm John Bermont —    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * *              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips?

I live in Italy and travel often by train. I personally always travel 2nd class unless I can’t find a seat there. 1st class has the advantage that it’s almost never full. If I can’t find a seat in 2nd class, I pay the additional cost for the 1st class ticket, plus a penalty for upgrading on the train. The seats in 1st class are marginally larger and maybe marginally more padded. The difference is so slight that I have occasionally taken a seat in 1st class, thinking it was 2nd class. I would rather pay extra to travel on an ES (Eurostar Italia) train. 2nd class on these trains beats 1st class on the IC trains, in my opinion. Barbara

Response:

I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps only on longer trips? Thanks Dennis

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips?

It depends upon the train.  On the fast, long-distance ES trains 2nd class is perfectly fine–you may as well save the dough.   On all other trains that are not crowded, 2nd class is o.k. too, though in 1st class the seats can be cushier, particularly on IC trains.  But on trains that are crowded and involve journey times of more than an hour or so, 1st class can be REALLY relaxing and pleasurable in comparison to sardine-can sitting or even standing in aisles. Part of it depends on whether you want to use train time as dreamy unwinding and relaxation time or not.  If so, 1st class can be really nice, and it’s not that much more expensive, though it really isn’t worth it on ES trains.

Response:

I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps only on longer trips? Thanks Dennis

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips?

It depends upon the train.  On the fast, long-distance ES trains 2nd class is perfectly fine–you may as well save the dough.   On all other trains that are not crowded, 2nd class is o.k. too, though in 1st class the seats can be cushier, particularly on IC trains.  But on trains that are crowded and involve journey times of more than an hour or so, 1st class can be REALLY relaxing and pleasurable in comparison to sardine-can sitting or even standing in aisles. Part of it depends on whether you want to use train time as dreamy unwinding and relaxation time or not.  If so, 1st class can be really nice, and it’s not that much more expensive, though it really isn’t worth it on ES trains.

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis

Dennis, For tips on using the trains see my page at http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm John Bermont —    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * *              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Response:

> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips?

I live in Italy and travel often by train. I personally always travel 2nd class unless I can’t find a seat there. 1st class has the advantage that it’s almost never full. If I can’t find a seat in 2nd class, I pay the additional cost for the 1st class ticket, plus a penalty for upgrading on the train. The seats in 1st class are marginally larger and maybe marginally more padded. The difference is so slight that I have occasionally taken a seat in 1st class, thinking it was 2nd class. I would rather pay extra to travel on an ES (Eurostar Italia) train. 2nd class on these trains beats 1st class on the IC trains, in my opinion. Barbara

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into >the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class >and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps >only on longer trips? > While the seats may be marginally more comfortable in first class, I don’t > think that’s the main reason that someone would pay the extra. In most cases > it would be to get away from the crowds. > So it’s worth checking out in advance whether the train you travel on is > likely to be full in second class, leaving you either jammed up against > someone else’s legs – or without a seat at all – if you can. If you’ve > got the time, and you’re in a town for a number of days, maybe take a look > at the same train on an earlier day and see how many people are on it, as > it leaves the station.

As I noted in another post, you can decide to upgrade once you’re on the train if 2nd class is too crowded. You pay a penalty for upgrading on the train, but it’s certainly more convenient than going to the station the day before to scope out the trains. Actually, if you’re travelling on a Friday, the conditions on Thursday wouldn’t be a very good predictor. Barbara

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis >Dennis, >For tips on using the trains see my page at >http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm >John Bermont >– >   * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >             http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Dennis, First class is to be recommended for -Businessmen or -women, whose employer authorizes firsz class travel (still cheaper than by car), or others with the necessary ressources willing to spend it for a little additional comfort: sometimes, FC also has plugs for PC and other electrical devices -Oversize people, that don’t fit into a second-class seat -Travel during peak periods, especially in poorer countries, where trains can get very crowded in 2nd class -peole that believe in class-difference (knighthood, tennis professionals or polo players, investment bankers, lawyers and other impostors) For all others, second class travel in Europe should be OK, particularly when traveling outside rush hours (Friay and Sunday evenings, or the start of a vacation period are worst). RH –

Response:

sit in first class if you want to sit with a bunch of  snobs who won’t talk to you. regards, Mark Holden

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis

Response:

As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure seats together. FWIW, my ex-parents in law took the kids by train first class and my daughters didn’t even notice a difference. Safe travels Liz — Posted via http://britishexpats.com

Response:

Thanks everybody for the responses. Sounds like unless you have money to burn, second class is the way to go -reserving an on-train upgrade to first if it is too crowded. -Dennis

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps > only on longer trips? > Thanks > Dennis > Dennis, > For tips on using the trains see my page at > http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm > John Bermont > — >    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks everybody for the responses. Sounds like unless you > have money to burn, second class is the way to go -reserving > an on-train upgrade to first if it is too crowded. > -Dennis > > I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into > > the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st > class > > and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or > perhaps > > only on longer trips? > > Thanks > > Dennis > Dennis, > For tips on using the trains see my page at > http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap17/rail.htm > John Bermont > — >    * * * Mastering Independent Budget Travel * * * >              http://www.enjoy-europe.com/

A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. Bruce

Response:

> As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by > train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I > didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next > time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But > no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second > class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure > seats together.

I have upgraded on the train in Italy, but I don’t want to speak for other countries. The original question was about Italy. However, it should be the same thing as getting on the train without a ticket, which in most countries means you pay the fare plus a penalty. The only difference is that they should credit you with the amount you paid for the second class ticket. I usually don’t reserve, even in 2nd class. However, on a really long trip, with several people travelling together I might do so. Not all trains, however, have the possibility of reserving seats. Barbara

Response:

> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess.

In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning. Barbara

Response:

> > As a mother of two living in Switzerland without a car, I travel by > train A LOT, and have never yet travelled in first class (although I > didn’t know you could upgrade on the train- we may try that the next > time we can’t find a seat and end up standing in the ski room!). But > no one has mentioned the fact that you can reserve seats in second > class- when we travel more than 2 hours we always do this to assure > seats together. > I have upgraded on the train in Italy, but I don’t want to speak for > other countries. The original question was about Italy. However, it > should be the same thing as getting on the train without a ticket, which > in most countries means you pay the fare plus a penalty. The only > difference is that they should credit you with the amount you paid for > the second class ticket.

In Austria you don’t actually have to have a ticket when you board, so you can buy th eticket on the train plus a small "administration fee". This also applies to upgrading to 1st class. If you have a 2nd-class ticket you’ll get to pay just the difference. Tim.

Response:

 couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that. We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I

guess. And probably the car wouldn’t have had A/C. Then you’d still be stupid, but there’s be no-one else to see it.  ;-) Tim.

Response:

>I’m planning a trip to Italy this coming April/May and in looking into >the train schedules I am wondering what the difference is between 1st class >and 2nd class. Better seats? Is it worth the money for 1st class or perhaps >only on longer trips?

Because it costs more, first class is usually less crowded. And the seats are bigger and usually in better condition. Plus if you’re over 26 and buy a Eurail pass, you’re required to get a first class pass. A truly cool book: The World Is Already Yours Conscious living in the real world www.alreadyyours.com (sample chapter, etc…)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice > and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart > enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We > ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 > hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. > BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. > Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. > In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and > 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t > blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. > Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning.

However usually it’s not working, apparently.      And/or the crowd feels it’s way too cold and turns it off? (OK, maybe not in the Eurostar.)

Response:

In addition its a lot quieter, wider seats and nothing like as busy. In Switz its not that much more expensive than 2nd. I go first when I go skiing because with a Halbtax Abo its worth it. Italy is cheap anyhow. UK forget it. Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Dennis, > First class is to be recommended for > -Businessmen or -women, whose employer authorizes firsz class travel (still cheaper than by > car), or others with the necessary ressources willing to spend it for a little additional comfort: > sometimes, FC also has plugs for PC and other electrical devices > -Oversize people, that don’t fit into a second-class seat > -Travel during peak periods, especially in poorer countries, where trains can get very > crowded in 2nd class > -peole that believe in class-difference (knighthood, tennis professionals or polo players, > investment bankers, lawyers and other impostors) > For all others, second class travel in Europe should be OK, particularly when traveling outside > rush hours (Friay and Sunday evenings, or the start of a vacation period are worst). > RH > –

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice >> and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart >> enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.  We >> ended up riding in 2nd class on a boiling hot day for I don’t know about 3 >> hours or so..   Felt pretty stupid. >> BTW, the smart thing would have been to rent a car since there were 3 of us. >> Just stupid.  You gotta think those things through before you go, I guess. > In Italy, the trains that have air conditioning have it in both 1st and > 2nd class. These are mostly the Eurostar trains. Therefore, you can’t > blame the heat on the fact that you were in 2nd class. > Eurostar Italia trains have air conditioning. > However usually it’s not working, apparently.      And/or the crowd > feels it’s way too cold and turns it off? > (OK, maybe not in the Eurostar.)

I’ve only once found a Eurostar car where the air conditioning wasn’t working. The conductor transferred us all to cars with working air conditioning; I ended up in first class. Most IC trains I’ve been in didn’t have air conditioning. I don’t know if this is true systemwide. Barbara

Response:

"Tim" wrote | And probably the car wouldn’t have had A/C. Then you’d still | be stupid, but there’s be no-one else to see it.  ;-) There’s be no-one else to see you take your clothes off in the heat, either Owain

Response:

> In Austria you don’t actually have to have a ticket when you board, so you > can buy th eticket on the train plus a small "administration fee".

The administration fee is EUR 3. If there is no possibility to buy the ticket at the station, you don’t need to pay the administration fee. > This also applies to upgrading to 1st class.

Also in this case NO administration fee has to be payed. — Regards, Helmut Uttenthaler Graz – Austria

Response:

>A couple of summers ago, we bought first class tickets from Milan to Venice >and found when we got on the train, all the seats were taken by people smart >enough to reserve seats–there’s a difference, if you can believe that.

Your first class ticket from Milan to Venice gives you access to any of several (2 per hour during parts of the day) trains running from Milan to Venice every day that your ticket is valid. Do you really expect them to hold a seat for you on all these trains? — Ask me for directions.

Response:

Question:

> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

I think Venice would be my choice. It has an instant visual appeal and you can get something out of a short visit. Rome also has many things that might appeal to a child, but 2 or 3 days in Rome won’t even scratch the surface. Barbara

Response:

Last July we traveled in Italy.  We took our daughters 11 & 13 to Venice and traveled alone to Rome. I would vote Venice hands down over Rome for the kids.  Someone had referred to Venice as magical for the kids and indeed for our kids it was.  It was probably a highlight of a month’s vacation.   For me Rome has more appeal for adults. A couple of tips: – Give the girls cheap or throw away cameras – this really seemed to ‘pull’ our kids into the experience. – Stay at Pension Academia – ask for the family garden suite "Giorgio, or Fontana" – its fabulous and Dorsoduro was for my taste perfect -slightly away (15 minutes) from the chaos of San Marco’s but charming nevertheless. –  Ride the gondola in the early morning or late at night – avoids the crazy lines and often the Gondoliers will offer discount. – feeding the pigeons at San Marco’s is a highlight and very cheap fun – the glass shops are fun- kids seem to love the shops here – use the vaporetto and be wary of  private boat services which can really be expensive. – eat in the little bars and find the cheese and meat shops for snacks. – two nights / three days is perfect timing – but three nights is even better! You will not be disappointed if you chose Venice. Good luck

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

Two summers ago we took our girls, ages 11 and 6 turning 7, around Italy. We stayed outside Florence for a week, went up to Lake Garda, spent a few days in Venice, and then took a cruise that included  a day in Rome.  The kids liked Rome, loooved Venice. This summer we are going back, staying on the Amalfi coast, and spending 4 days or so in Rome before.  They want to head to Venice after the coast, as they say it’s their favorite city in the world.    I’d definitely go to Venice.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Last July we traveled in Italy.  We took our daughters 11 & 13 to Venice and > traveled alone to Rome. > I would vote Venice hands down over Rome for the kids.  Someone had referred > to Venice as magical for the kids and indeed for our kids it was.  It was > probably a highlight of a month’s vacation.   For me Rome has more appeal > for adults. > A couple of tips: > – Give the girls cheap or throw away cameras – this really seemed to ‘pull’ > our kids into the experience. > – Stay at Pension Academia – ask for the family garden suite "Giorgio, or > Fontana" – its fabulous and Dorsoduro was for my taste perfect -slightly > away (15 minutes) from the chaos of San Marco’s but charming nevertheless. > –  Ride the gondola in the early morning or late at night – avoids the crazy > lines and often the Gondoliers will offer discount. > – feeding the pigeons at San Marco’s is a highlight and very cheap fun > – the glass shops are fun- kids seem to love the shops here > – use the vaporetto and be wary of  private boat services which can really > be expensive. > – eat in the little bars and find the cheese and meat shops for snacks. > – two nights / three days is perfect timing – but three nights is even > better! > You will not be disappointed if you chose Venice. > Good luck > We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

I just went to both cities in early January.(My first trip to Italy.First trip to Europe actually.) I stayed in Rome most of the time but took a 3 day trip to Venice. I have to say as great as Rome is I preferred Venice much more. No traffic is a huge plus. Although from Florence it should only be a 2 hour train ride to either destination. So I`d recommended trying to do both. It was only 4 hours from Rome to Venice. If you have to pick one though, I`d give the nod to Venice. Hope this helps

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 if that makes any difference. Thanks, Will

Response:

> The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

Absolutely no doubt about it.  Rome is grueling (though rewarding) enough for adults.  Venice is quiet and peaceful (except for the tourists).  There is no traffic (except for the gondolas and vaporetti).  They will love the tiny glass animal figurines in the shop windows.  A no-brainer.

Response:

> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

I think a question like that has no answer. I love both Rome and Venice, and I wouldn’t want to have to choose between them. If you’ve never been to either, you should go to both; if you can’t do both this trip, choose one and make plans to come back to the other another time. I don’t think two or three days is enough for either city, but it’s not as badly too little for Venice. So I’d probably make that my choice for now. — Ken Blake Please reply to the newsgroup

Response:

We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 if that makes any difference. Thanks, Will

Response:

> The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

Absolutely no doubt about it.  Rome is grueling (though rewarding) enough for adults.  Venice is quiet and peaceful (except for the tourists).  There is no traffic (except for the gondolas and vaporetti).  They will love the tiny glass animal figurines in the shop windows.  A no-brainer.

Response:

> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

I think a question like that has no answer. I love both Rome and Venice, and I wouldn’t want to have to choose between them. If you’ve never been to either, you should go to both; if you can’t do both this trip, choose one and make plans to come back to the other another time. I don’t think two or three days is enough for either city, but it’s not as badly too little for Venice. So I’d probably make that my choice for now. — Ken Blake Please reply to the newsgroup

Response:

I just went to both cities in early January.(My first trip to Italy.First trip to Europe actually.) I stayed in Rome most of the time but took a 3 day trip to Venice. I have to say as great as Rome is I preferred Venice much more. No traffic is a huge plus. Although from Florence it should only be a 2 hour train ride to either destination. So I`d recommended trying to do both. It was only 4 hours from Rome to Venice. If you have to pick one though, I`d give the nod to Venice. Hope this helps

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference.

I think Venice would be my choice. It has an instant visual appeal and you can get something out of a short visit. Rome also has many things that might appeal to a child, but 2 or 3 days in Rome won’t even scratch the surface. Barbara

Response:

Last July we traveled in Italy.  We took our daughters 11 & 13 to Venice and traveled alone to Rome. I would vote Venice hands down over Rome for the kids.  Someone had referred to Venice as magical for the kids and indeed for our kids it was.  It was probably a highlight of a month’s vacation.   For me Rome has more appeal for adults. A couple of tips: – Give the girls cheap or throw away cameras – this really seemed to ‘pull’ our kids into the experience. – Stay at Pension Academia – ask for the family garden suite "Giorgio, or Fontana" – its fabulous and Dorsoduro was for my taste perfect -slightly away (15 minutes) from the chaos of San Marco’s but charming nevertheless. –  Ride the gondola in the early morning or late at night – avoids the crazy lines and often the Gondoliers will offer discount. – feeding the pigeons at San Marco’s is a highlight and very cheap fun – the glass shops are fun- kids seem to love the shops here – use the vaporetto and be wary of  private boat services which can really be expensive. – eat in the little bars and find the cheese and meat shops for snacks. – two nights / three days is perfect timing – but three nights is even better! You will not be disappointed if you chose Venice. Good luck

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

Two summers ago we took our girls, ages 11 and 6 turning 7, around Italy. We stayed outside Florence for a week, went up to Lake Garda, spent a few days in Venice, and then took a cruise that included  a day in Rome.  The kids liked Rome, loooved Venice. This summer we are going back, staying on the Amalfi coast, and spending 4 days or so in Rome before.  They want to head to Venice after the coast, as they say it’s their favorite city in the world.    I’d definitely go to Venice.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Last July we traveled in Italy.  We took our daughters 11 & 13 to Venice and > traveled alone to Rome. > I would vote Venice hands down over Rome for the kids.  Someone had referred > to Venice as magical for the kids and indeed for our kids it was.  It was > probably a highlight of a month’s vacation.   For me Rome has more appeal > for adults. > A couple of tips: > – Give the girls cheap or throw away cameras – this really seemed to ‘pull’ > our kids into the experience. > – Stay at Pension Academia – ask for the family garden suite "Giorgio, or > Fontana" – its fabulous and Dorsoduro was for my taste perfect -slightly > away (15 minutes) from the chaos of San Marco’s but charming nevertheless. > –  Ride the gondola in the early morning or late at night – avoids the crazy > lines and often the Gondoliers will offer discount. > – feeding the pigeons at San Marco’s is a highlight and very cheap fun > – the glass shops are fun- kids seem to love the shops here > – use the vaporetto and be wary of  private boat services which can really > be expensive. > – eat in the little bars and find the cheese and meat shops for snacks. > – two nights / three days is perfect timing – but three nights is even > better! > You will not be disappointed if you chose Venice. > Good luck > We are going to spend a couple of weeks around Florence in early June. > After Florence we’ll have two or three more days to explore one other > Italian city. We are trying to decide if we’d rather spend the time in > Venice or Rome. The Frommers Guide Book says that it should be Venice > hands down. What are your thoughts? We have two daughters ages 6 and 8 > if that makes any difference. > Thanks, > Will

Response:

Question:

> Hi, > I’ll be travelling with my wife and child to Italy in March for a > weeks skiing, based in Campitello di Fassa. Accommodation is arranged > already so now all I neeed to sort out is transport. Looking at the > budget airlines there are a couple of options: Verona (Brescia) or > Venice (Treviso). I plan on hiring a car and driving, so am wondering > from a driving point of view which would be better. From a map it > looks like Venice would be closer but it also looks like more of the > journey would be on mountain roads, and therefore in practice take > longer. > Has anyone made either of these journies who could comment?

If you plan to travel to Campitello, you should try to minimize driving on mountain roads, and use motorways as much as possible; even if this means a longer route, it also means a shorter travel time. So, there are two possible routes to Campitello: you take the Brenner motorway from Verona heading north, you get out of the motorway at Ora and then you drive up the Fiemme and the Fassa valleys (this is probably the quickest itinerary). Or you get out of the motorway at Bolzano and you drive the Costalunga pass (scenic but narrow road). As Brescia is closer to Verona than Venice, it should take a shorter time leaving from there. I remember doing these routes when I was a child, and the Brenner motorway was still to be built. Doing the mountain routes – as well as the road coasting the Garda lake took almost forever.

Response:

Ian, Ryan Air fly to Turin, and Milan, and I think Easyjet fly to Milan is that helps at all. Regards, Greg

Response:

Greg Hilton schrieb: > Ian, > Ryan Air fly to Turin, and Milan, and I think Easyjet fly to Milan > is that helps at all.

Ryanair fly to Bergamo and call that Milan. Regards, ULF

Response:

Hi, I’ll be travelling with my wife and child to Italy in March for a weeks skiing, based in Campitello di Fassa. Accommodation is arranged already so now all I neeed to sort out is transport. Looking at the budget airlines there are a couple of options: Verona (Brescia) or Venice (Treviso). I plan on hiring a car and driving, so am wondering from a driving point of view which would be better. From a map it looks like Venice would be closer but it also looks like more of the journey would be on mountain roads, and therefore in practice take longer. Has anyone made either of these journies who could comment? Cheers, Ian

Response:

Hi, I’ll be travelling with my wife and child to Italy in March for a weeks skiing, based in Campitello di Fassa. Accommodation is arranged already so now all I neeed to sort out is transport. Looking at the budget airlines there are a couple of options: Verona (Brescia) or Venice (Treviso). I plan on hiring a car and driving, so am wondering from a driving point of view which would be better. From a map it looks like Venice would be closer but it also looks like more of the journey would be on mountain roads, and therefore in practice take longer. Has anyone made either of these journies who could comment? Cheers, Ian

Response:

Ian, Ryan Air fly to Turin, and Milan, and I think Easyjet fly to Milan is that helps at all. Regards, Greg

Response:

Greg Hilton schrieb: > Ian, > Ryan Air fly to Turin, and Milan, and I think Easyjet fly to Milan > is that helps at all.

Ryanair fly to Bergamo and call that Milan. Regards, ULF

Response:

> Hi, > I’ll be travelling with my wife and child to Italy in March for a > weeks skiing, based in Campitello di Fassa. Accommodation is arranged > already so now all I neeed to sort out is transport. Looking at the > budget airlines there are a couple of options: Verona (Brescia) or > Venice (Treviso). I plan on hiring a car and driving, so am wondering > from a driving point of view which would be better. From a map it > looks like Venice would be closer but it also looks like more of the > journey would be on mountain roads, and therefore in practice take > longer. > Has anyone made either of these journies who could comment?

If you plan to travel to Campitello, you should try to minimize driving on mountain roads, and use motorways as much as possible; even if this means a longer route, it also means a shorter travel time. So, there are two possible routes to Campitello: you take the Brenner motorway from Verona heading north, you get out of the motorway at Ora and then you drive up the Fiemme and the Fassa valleys (this is probably the quickest itinerary). Or you get out of the motorway at Bolzano and you drive the Costalunga pass (scenic but narrow road). As Brescia is closer to Verona than Venice, it should take a shorter time leaving from there. I remember doing these routes when I was a child, and the Brenner motorway was still to be built. Doing the mountain routes – as well as the road coasting the Garda lake took almost forever.

Response:

Question:

There was a time when people were flamed (not sure if it was this NG) for wasting bandwidth for saying thanks. I think the best type of thanks is like Kitty’s passing on a few tips. Anyway ‘thanks’ to all who have helped me, and ‘no problem’ if I have ever helped anyone (i don’t think I help Kitty either)

Response:

I just wanted to put out a "thank you" to all who responded to my questions for my trip to Italy, Austria, and Switzerland.  I just got back last night.  Knowing how to get to the Central Station from Malpensa, how to catch the vaporatto and that we could take our luggage on them, things like that really helped ease the travel stress.  And, yes, St. Moritz was EXPENSIVE.  Having the dinner plan was a good idea. The drive from Bolzano to Cortina was spectacular, probably one of the best I’ve ever been on (and worth the car sickness I always get on windy roads).  Got a complimentary ticket to the polo matches on the frozen lake in St. Moritz (knew one of the people involved) – it was fun to feel like one of the "rich and famous" if only for a few hours. We just wandered around streets in Venice, following what looked like groups of locals and ended up in some very nice areas and found ourselves back where we started around Piazza San Marcos and we don’t know how it happened.  The recommendation for the hotel near Malpensa (Villa Malpensa) was great – it was a nice, relaxing way to end the 2 weeks of traveling. Again, thanks to all! Kitty

Response:

Thanks for the "thanks" to the group Kitty. Don’t know whether I responded to your post or not but it’s becoming increasingly rare for seekers of travel info to say "thanks" either in your post trip form or when the post is answered. I know it affects me. Many’s the time I see a post asking about specific info. I know the answer, and wanting to help, go to our travel log, search for the info on (insert name of hotel, train station or airport here), go back to the computer, compose a post, hit the "send" button, and after several days and several posts by we have to do is sit around and be their private research team. I carefully weigh whether I want to spend the time now. Anyway, it’s refreshing to see your message.  Glad you had a great trip. We’re American and were in St. Moritz on Sept. 13, 2001 (we we’re in Lagano Sept. 11) and had a hotel high on the hill. I looked down on the village and saw atop the big old main hotel both the Swiss and American flags flying side by side at half mast. Doug Burke – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I just wanted to put out a "thank you" to all who responded to my > questions for my trip to Italy, Austria, and Switzerland.  I just got > back last night.  Knowing how to get to the Central Station from > Malpensa, how to catch the vaporatto and that we could take our luggage > on them, things like that really helped ease the travel stress.  And, > yes, St. Moritz was EXPENSIVE.  Having the dinner plan was a good idea. > The drive from Bolzano to Cortina was spectacular, probably one of the > best I’ve ever been on (and worth the car sickness I always get on > windy roads).  Got a complimentary ticket to the polo matches on the > frozen lake in St. Moritz (knew one of the people involved) – it was > fun to feel like one of the "rich and famous" if only for a few hours. > We just wandered around streets in Venice, following what looked like > groups of locals and ended up in some very nice areas and found > ourselves back where we started around Piazza San Marcos and we don’t > know how it happened.  The recommendation for the hotel near Malpensa > (Villa Malpensa) was great – it was a nice, relaxing way to end the 2 > weeks of traveling. > Again, thanks to all! > Kitty

Response:

>Thanks for the "thanks" to the group Kitty. Don’t know whether I responded >to your post or not but it’s becoming increasingly rare for seekers of >travel info to say "thanks" either in your post trip form or when the post >is answered. I know it affects me. Many’s the time I see a post asking >about specific info. I know the answer, and wanting to help, go to our >travel log, search for the info on (insert name of hotel, train station or >airport here), go back to the computer, compose a post, hit the "send" >button, and after several days and several posts by >we have to do is sit around and be their private research team. I carefully >weigh whether I want to spend the time now. Anyway, it’s refreshing to see >your message.

Hear, hear! It’s good of Kitty to put her gratitude on record (and I don’t qualify for any of it). My impression is that fewer than half of those to whose enquiries I respond think of saying thank you — some in the group, some in email. It’s those people who keep me interested. If I could figure out how to separate those with good manners from those without, then I would post less. Mind you, there is another payback: sometimes a post in response to an enquiry leads to interesting exchanges of ideas, information, experience, and jests. And then we can be flamed… PB

Response:

I just wanted to put out a "thank you" to all who responded to my questions for my trip to Italy, Austria, and Switzerland.  I just got back last night.  Knowing how to get to the Central Station from Malpensa, how to catch the vaporatto and that we could take our luggage on them, things like that really helped ease the travel stress.  And, yes, St. Moritz was EXPENSIVE.  Having the dinner plan was a good idea. The drive from Bolzano to Cortina was spectacular, probably one of the best I’ve ever been on (and worth the car sickness I always get on windy roads).  Got a complimentary ticket to the polo matches on the frozen lake in St. Moritz (knew one of the people involved) – it was fun to feel like one of the "rich and famous" if only for a few hours. We just wandered around streets in Venice, following what looked like groups of locals and ended up in some very nice areas and found ourselves back where we started around Piazza San Marcos and we don’t know how it happened.  The recommendation for the hotel near Malpensa (Villa Malpensa) was great – it was a nice, relaxing way to end the 2 weeks of traveling. Again, thanks to all! Kitty

Response:

Thanks for the "thanks" to the group Kitty. Don’t know whether I responded to your post or not but it’s becoming increasingly rare for seekers of travel info to say "thanks" either in your post trip form or when the post is answered. I know it affects me. Many’s the time I see a post asking about specific info. I know the answer, and wanting to help, go to our travel log, search for the info on (insert name of hotel, train station or airport here), go back to the computer, compose a post, hit the "send" button, and after several days and several posts by we have to do is sit around and be their private research team. I carefully weigh whether I want to spend the time now. Anyway, it’s refreshing to see your message.  Glad you had a great trip. We’re American and were in St. Moritz on Sept. 13, 2001 (we we’re in Lagano Sept. 11) and had a hotel high on the hill. I looked down on the village and saw atop the big old main hotel both the Swiss and American flags flying side by side at half mast. Doug Burke – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I just wanted to put out a "thank you" to all who responded to my > questions for my trip to Italy, Austria, and Switzerland.  I just got > back last night.  Knowing how to get to the Central Station from > Malpensa, how to catch the vaporatto and that we could take our luggage > on them, things like that really helped ease the travel stress.  And, > yes, St. Moritz was EXPENSIVE.  Having the dinner plan was a good idea. > The drive from Bolzano to Cortina was spectacular, probably one of the > best I’ve ever been on (and worth the car sickness I always get on > windy roads).  Got a complimentary ticket to the polo matches on the > frozen lake in St. Moritz (knew one of the people involved) – it was > fun to feel like one of the "rich and famous" if only for a few hours. > We just wandered around streets in Venice, following what looked like > groups of locals and ended up in some very nice areas and found > ourselves back where we started around Piazza San Marcos and we don’t > know how it happened.  The recommendation for the hotel near Malpensa > (Villa Malpensa) was great – it was a nice, relaxing way to end the 2 > weeks of traveling. > Again, thanks to all! > Kitty

Response:

>Thanks for the "thanks" to the group Kitty. Don’t know whether I responded >to your post or not but it’s becoming increasingly rare for seekers of >travel info to say "thanks" either in your post trip form or when the post >is answered. I know it affects me. Many’s the time I see a post asking >about specific info. I know the answer, and wanting to help, go to our >travel log, search for the info on (insert name of hotel, train station or >airport here), go back to the computer, compose a post, hit the "send" >button, and after several days and several posts by >we have to do is sit around and be their private research team. I carefully >weigh whether I want to spend the time now. Anyway, it’s refreshing to see >your message.

Hear, hear! It’s good of Kitty to put her gratitude on record (and I don’t qualify for any of it). My impression is that fewer than half of those to whose enquiries I respond think of saying thank you — some in the group, some in email. It’s those people who keep me interested. If I could figure out how to separate those with good manners from those without, then I would post less. Mind you, there is another payback: sometimes a post in response to an enquiry leads to interesting exchanges of ideas, information, experience, and jests. And then we can be flamed… PB

Response:

There was a time when people were flamed (not sure if it was this NG) for wasting bandwidth for saying thanks. I think the best type of thanks is like Kitty’s passing on a few tips. Anyway ‘thanks’ to all who have helped me, and ‘no problem’ if I have ever helped anyone (i don’t think I help Kitty either)

Response:

Question:

> On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested > by the Rough Guide.

They are kind of ’sketchy’.  They list high-end and low-end places in one smear.  But the places I’ve gotten through the Rough Guide (the Monges in Alicante which was super cheap and super comfortable and Hostal Berlin in Marbella which was a great location and excellent value) have been really worthwhile–so they’re not ALL bad.

Response:

> > On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested > by the Rough Guide. > They are kind of ’sketchy’.  They list high-end and low-end places in one > smear.  But the places I’ve gotten through the Rough Guide (the Monges in > Alicante which was super cheap and super comfortable and Hostal Berlin in > Marbella which was a great location and excellent value) have been really > worthwhile–so they’re not ALL bad.

They described a pensione in Madrid as having a congenial host, but neglected to mention that it was on the 5th floor (6th American numbering) with no elevator, that the final flight of stairs was of rotten wood, and that there were no staff on-site. I got the impression that they made a few phone calls, but had never seen the place. I had a similar bad experience with a hostale they recommended in Salamanca. The room was so small that they had to use a special (home-made) short bed. I am 5 feet 4 inches (160 cm) and my feet hung over the end. On the other hand, we found the recommendations in the Guide Roulard to be very reliable. On an earlier trip, I had good results with Let’s Go. Barbara

Response:

hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to the following accommodation questions: 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean but i would prefer my own room. 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will be in europe? if so, how far ahead? 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to have some places in mind just in case. any help is appreciated. SKI

Response:

Hi Barbara I work and live in Rome and I can tell you that a single room in a nice clean place should cost about 50 euro in high season. For the April – June period it is always better to book ahead, being that this is high season in the major art cities in Italy, because of the nice weather in that period. Lonely planet and Let’s Go usually have good recommendations for budget places that are centrally located. Enjoy your holiday! Chiara www.centralromehotels.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room. > The price will vary quite a lot by city, even within the same country. > In general, Portugal will be the cheapest and Italy the most expensive > of the three you mention. Within Italy, a single room will cost a good > deal more in Rome and Venice than in other cities. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead? > At that time of year, you should be able to find rooms calling ahead a > few days. In central Spain, we found that inexpensive hotels were rather > booked up in late April and early May, but we still managed to find > rooms with just a few days advance booking. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated. > I have made extensive use of Let’s Go for budget lodgings in both Spain > and Italy, and have found them very reliable. They give detailed pricing > information for different categories of room within a hotel, and are > usually pretty up to date in their information. In Spain, I also found > the French series "Le Guide Routard" very useful, but I don’t know if > it’s available in English. (Mine is an Italian translation.) > Barbara

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i > will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead? > In Spain prices go sky-high and you can come up completely empty many places > during Holy Week (Semana Santa), which is about April 12th to 20th.  It is > VERY hard to get rooms in places like Seville–people book a year in > advance.  In fact, that’s a popular travel time anywhere in the > Mediterannean.  Most of the rest of late spring you should do very well > practically anywhere you go though! > are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and > evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would > like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated. > Lonely Planet, Let’s Go, the Rough Guides–they are all great for your > needs–and they are really the place to look to start scouting things out.

On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested by the Rough Guide. Barbara

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For Rome, I have used the reservation service at www.venere.com Even if you don’t reserve throgh it, you could use that to get an idea about how much you should expect to pay. Elena

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> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room.

The price will vary quite a lot by city, even within the same country. In general, Portugal will be the cheapest and Italy the most expensive of the three you mention. Within Italy, a single room will cost a good deal more in Rome and Venice than in other cities. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

At that time of year, you should be able to find rooms calling ahead a few days. In central Spain, we found that inexpensive hotels were rather booked up in late April and early May, but we still managed to find rooms with just a few days advance booking. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

I have made extensive use of Let’s Go for budget lodgings in both Spain and Italy, and have found them very reliable. They give detailed pricing information for different categories of room within a hotel, and are usually pretty up to date in their information. In Spain, I also found the French series "Le Guide Routard" very useful, but I don’t know if it’s available in English. (Mine is an Italian translation.) Barbara

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> 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

In Spain prices go sky-high and you can come up completely empty many places during Holy Week (Semana Santa), which is about April 12th to 20th.  It is VERY hard to get rooms in places like Seville–people book a year in advance.  In fact, that’s a popular travel time anywhere in the Mediterannean.  Most of the rest of late spring you should do very well practically anywhere you go though! > are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

Lonely Planet, Let’s Go, the Rough Guides–they are all great for your needs–and they are really the place to look to start scouting things out.

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> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room.

Maybe 30-60.  April may be off peak season enough to get lower prices. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

I was in Italy in September and calling ahead helped, but it wasn’t necessary.  If you can, do so according to a guidebook you trust, but if you cannot find one before you arrive you oughtn’t worry overmuch. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and > evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like > to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

I found the Lonely Planet to be pretty details, with info on budget places.  It isn’t updated annually, however.  I really like Rick Steves’ books, too.  I suggest you visit a bookstore and see if his country-specific guides cover the areas in which you are interested, and if so, stick with those guys. > SKI

– Dan Stephenson Grand Tour photos and video: http://homepage.mac.com/stepheda

Response:

hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to the following accommodation questions: 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean but i would prefer my own room. 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will be in europe? if so, how far ahead? 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to have some places in mind just in case. any help is appreciated. SKI

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> 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

In Spain prices go sky-high and you can come up completely empty many places during Holy Week (Semana Santa), which is about April 12th to 20th.  It is VERY hard to get rooms in places like Seville–people book a year in advance.  In fact, that’s a popular travel time anywhere in the Mediterannean.  Most of the rest of late spring you should do very well practically anywhere you go though! > are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

Lonely Planet, Let’s Go, the Rough Guides–they are all great for your needs–and they are really the place to look to start scouting things out.

Response:

> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room.

Maybe 30-60.  April may be off peak season enough to get lower prices. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

I was in Italy in September and calling ahead helped, but it wasn’t necessary.  If you can, do so according to a guidebook you trust, but if you cannot find one before you arrive you oughtn’t worry overmuch. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and > evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like > to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

I found the Lonely Planet to be pretty details, with info on budget places.  It isn’t updated annually, however.  I really like Rick Steves’ books, too.  I suggest you visit a bookstore and see if his country-specific guides cover the areas in which you are interested, and if so, stick with those guys. > SKI

– Dan Stephenson Grand Tour photos and video: http://homepage.mac.com/stepheda

Response:

For Rome, I have used the reservation service at www.venere.com Even if you don’t reserve throgh it, you could use that to get an idea about how much you should expect to pay. Elena

Response:

> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room.

The price will vary quite a lot by city, even within the same country. In general, Portugal will be the cheapest and Italy the most expensive of the three you mention. Within Italy, a single room will cost a good deal more in Rome and Venice than in other cities. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead?

At that time of year, you should be able to find rooms calling ahead a few days. In central Spain, we found that inexpensive hotels were rather booked up in late April and early May, but we still managed to find rooms with just a few days advance booking. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated.

I have made extensive use of Let’s Go for budget lodgings in both Spain and Italy, and have found them very reliable. They give detailed pricing information for different categories of room within a hotel, and are usually pretty up to date in their information. In Spain, I also found the French series "Le Guide Routard" very useful, but I don’t know if it’s available in English. (Mine is an Italian translation.) Barbara

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i > will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead? > In Spain prices go sky-high and you can come up completely empty many places > during Holy Week (Semana Santa), which is about April 12th to 20th.  It is > VERY hard to get rooms in places like Seville–people book a year in > advance.  In fact, that’s a popular travel time anywhere in the > Mediterannean.  Most of the rest of late spring you should do very well > practically anywhere you go though! > are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and > evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would > like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated. > Lonely Planet, Let’s Go, the Rough Guides–they are all great for your > needs–and they are really the place to look to start scouting things out.

On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested by the Rough Guide. Barbara

Response:

Hi Barbara I work and live in Rome and I can tell you that a single room in a nice clean place should cost about 50 euro in high season. For the April – June period it is always better to book ahead, being that this is high season in the major art cities in Italy, because of the nice weather in that period. Lonely planet and Let’s Go usually have good recommendations for budget places that are centrally located. Enjoy your holiday! Chiara www.centralromehotels.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> hello all, ill be visiting the major cities in portugal, spain, and italy next > spring (sometime between april and june) and i was looking for some answers to > the following accommodation questions: > 1. how much in euros should i expect to pay per night for a clean, centrally > located single room? i dont mind sharing a bathroom as long as its very clean > but i would prefer my own room. > The price will vary quite a lot by city, even within the same country. > In general, Portugal will be the cheapest and Italy the most expensive > of the three you mention. Within Italy, a single room will cost a good > deal more in Rome and Venice than in other cities. > 2. would it be best for me to book ahead, given the season (april-june) i will > be in europe? if so, how far ahead? > At that time of year, you should be able to find rooms calling ahead a > few days. In central Spain, we found that inexpensive hotels were rather > booked up in late April and early May, but we still managed to find > rooms with just a few days advance booking. > 3. are there any good travel guides that have accurate listings and evaluations > of budget places? i am willing to look around once i travel but i would like to > have some places in mind just in case. > any help is appreciated. > I have made extensive use of Let’s Go for budget lodgings in both Spain > and Italy, and have found them very reliable. They give detailed pricing > information for different categories of room within a hotel, and are > usually pretty up to date in their information. In Spain, I also found > the French series "Le Guide Routard" very useful, but I don’t know if > it’s available in English. (Mine is an Italian translation.) > Barbara

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> On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested > by the Rough Guide.

They are kind of ’sketchy’.  They list high-end and low-end places in one smear.  But the places I’ve gotten through the Rough Guide (the Monges in Alicante which was super cheap and super comfortable and Hostal Berlin in Marbella which was a great location and excellent value) have been really worthwhile–so they’re not ALL bad.

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> > On a recent trip to Spain, I had very poor results with rooms suggested > by the Rough Guide. > They are kind of ’sketchy’.  They list high-end and low-end places in one > smear.  But the places I’ve gotten through the Rough Guide (the Monges in > Alicante which was super cheap and super comfortable and Hostal Berlin in > Marbella which was a great location and excellent value) have been really > worthwhile–so they’re not ALL bad.

They described a pensione in Madrid as having a congenial host, but neglected to mention that it was on the 5th floor (6th American numbering) with no elevator, that the final flight of stairs was of rotten wood, and that there were no staff on-site. I got the impression that they made a few phone calls, but had never seen the place. I had a similar bad experience with a hostale they recommended in Salamanca. The room was so small that they had to use a special (home-made) short bed. I am 5 feet 4 inches (160 cm) and my feet hung over the end. On the other hand, we found the recommendations in the Guide Roulard to be very reliable. On an earlier trip, I had good results with Let’s Go. Barbara

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